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Hi Folks,
Two weeks ago I installed new brake pads in the rear of my 1992 245. The new pads squeek like crazy. I did use shims behind the pads, but I guess I need something additional to stop the vibration/squeeking. Any suggestions? I got the brake pads from FCP Groton and I think they are Australian made.
Did I mention that Jay Fiedler stinks?
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Ohhh.. I see that a lot of you really have a solution for this problem!
But still:
The problem is that the brakepads are to hard - against the rotor that courses vibrations that travels on and then end up as squeeks. Everything proposed is an "emergency-solution" and the too hard brakepad will wear down the rotor quicker.
Considering effort, extra time spent, extra money spent on speciel anti-squekk-products and all - It couldn't then still be more expensive to by OEM parts?
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Soren,
You make a good point. My front brakes (rotors and pads) were done just before I bought my car. They are Volvo OEM and have over 80K (miles) on them and are still going strong without squeeks. Last time I looked there was plenty left on them.
I have a new brake issue. I think one of my rear caliper pistons is stuck. So I am going to take a good look at all my brakes. If needed, I'll replace the pads on all four wheels (and anything else that is needed) and I'm going to give some serious consideration to using Volvo pads and shims this time.
BTW - Many people on this board put in aftermarket pads for better braking performance...
Jim
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Jim 90 244DL 245K
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Jim,
Thanks! -and THAT is exactly my point! Volvo really did put in a lot of effort to make their cars quality and long lasting - therefore brakepads, rotors and calipers and so on where carefully specified for each other. That philosofy builded the car - Do you know ANY other brand that has been able to make a profitable business, making and selling a car model that only changed small details of looks over the years?
The PV from 1947 - 1965 (the van-model to 1969!), the 120 from 1956/7 - 1970, the 140 (where a 240 more or less is a 140..) from 1966 - 1992!??
:-)
Use OEM Volvo parts! If you give your wife a fur, she soon wants diamants.. If you give your Volvo OEM parts, she loves you! (read she = your car!)
:-)
"Better braking perfomance"? -better because the brakepad "eats" more of the rotor and therefore creates better resistance? Where they then thinking of, that a "better braking performance" maybe overheat the rotors and wear them down quicker?
I know.. It's a crusade!
Oh, and did Volvo just hired and builded a hole department for brakes and then paid them salery to watch Björn Borg to play tennis?..
Well, sorry if I go to far..
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Try cut litlebit off brake-pad corners.
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I just redid the brakes on our beautiful silver '88 244 GL. I replaced all four rotors (the rears were shot, the fronts probably had a few k-miles left on them), the pads, master cylinder, hoses, and pad mounting hardware. I also cleaned, repacked and adjusted the front wheel bearings, one of which was a bit loose. The brakes now feel great. They're quiet, the pedal is solid, and there is absolutely no vibration.
On the advice of Board members, I used ATE rotors, shims, and PBR Deluxe pads from eEuroparts. The hoses, hardware, brake/shim grease, and ATE master cylinder came from FCP Groton.
I bench bled the new master cylinder (acknowledgement to the Board FAQ and archives) after installing it and before reconnecting the brake lines, then connected the lines pressure bled the system using bled the system using a Motive Products Power Brake Bleeder. I feel the following steps contributed to a good brake job:
- One nice thing about replacing the rotors is that it allows you to give the calipers a good cleaning. I used a brass wire brush to thoroughly clean the pad slots. I cleaned the piston boots with a nylon toothbrush and brake cleaner solvent.
- In addition to placing brake grease on BOTH sides of the shims, I applied it to the caliper pad slots, pistons, and pad mounting pins and springs.
- Before mounting them, I used brake cleaner to clean the oil off the new rotors (don't forget the parking brake friction surface on the rear rotors), and scored the friction surfaces with medium grit sandpaper to speed break-in.
- I used clean wooden cedar shims to spread the brakes. Replacing both rotors and worn pads meant that the pistons had to retract a lot before the new rotor edges would slip between the new pads. I used three shims: two stationary in contact with the pads, and third in the middle that I tapped to spread the stack and compress the pistons. Picture my three shim stack replacing the rotor disc between the pads. The approach worked well. The pad surfaces remained clean and undamaged, and there was no damage to the pistons.
- I wire-brushed all bleed screws and soaked them with PB Blaster before attempting to loosen them. All came loose with no problem.
- I went through the bleed cycle in the prescribed order TWICE. I used a clear hose on the bleed screws to prevent air backflow (a tendency minimized by the pressure bleeder). At some point during the bleeds, I rotated the screws back and forth. This oscillating motion seemed to free up additional dirty fluid on about half the screws, and a few tiny air bubbles on two or three others. I gently tapped the calipers, hoses, and accessible lines to free as much air as possible. And yes, I did get a little extra air out on the second bleed cycle.
- When I repacked the front wheel bearings, I noticed some score marks on the front race, undoubtedly a result of them being a bit loose. I replaced that hub with one from a parts car, which had perfect races. The SKF bearings were in excellent condition, with no spalling or scoring on the rolling elements. In addition to worn pads, the brake job had been prompted by a slight front end shimmy we sometimes experienced when braking. In retrospect, that shimmy was probably caused or at least amplified by the loose wheel bearings. Repacking the bearings is VERY cheap ($5 or so for half a can of Valvoline synthetic grease, 42 cents for two new cotter pins).
Good luck, Dan. It takes new pads a while to conform to the rotor surfaces, especially if the rotors have worn. If the noise doesn't abate, check the rotor disk thickness and runout. Make sure that retainers on the pad pins are driven completely into their holes. Grease the caliper pad slots and pistons. If all else fails, purchase a new set of rotors and see if that fixes the problem.
--
'88 244GL, '89 244GL, '90 244DL, '91 244, '92 244
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posted by
someone claiming to be JimL
on
Wed Oct 20 04:30 CST 2004 [ RELATED]
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Good poop on brake work - thanks for the details.
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I just installed Ate Power Disks and PBR Metal Masters (aka Axis pads from Australia) from FCP on all four corners. No squeaks, shimmies, etc. I used my old shims and just cleaned them off with wire brush and brake cleaner. Did you use brake silicone or a similiar anti-squeal product and apply it on the shims and back of the brake pads? For some reason when I removed the calipers from the rear each pad had two shims for a total of 4 for each rear caliper...I reused all 8 but weird...
Best,
Adam
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'92 244GL silver-metallic, 150k, Enem V15 cam, Bilstein HDs, IPD sways, upper+lower braces, Cherry-Turbo strut brace, 240 OEM rear spoiler, 15' Dracos, E-codes w/side repeaters, Euro cowl covers paint-matched, Magnaflow 2.5' SS exhaust w/Unitek header
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Adam,
When I did my rear brakes, I also discovered there were 4 shims per caliper. Factory setup or previous brake job???
Since this was 2 1/2 years ago I'm not 100% sure, but I believe I bought and installed just 2 new shims per caliper (plus new hardware). One for each pad. No issues with just two....
Jim
--
Jim 90 244DL 245K
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Jim,
Yeah interesting that the rears had 4 per caliper. I think the last time I had the rears done, the car was in the shop for something significant and my Volvo guy just went ahead and the rears anyway...perhaps factory specs?? I thought I was the only one. Forgot to add that I too bought the hardware kits (springs and pins).
Best,
Adam
--
'92 244GL silver-metallic, 150k, Enem V15 cam, Bilstein HDs, IPD sways, upper+lower braces, Cherry-Turbo strut brace, 240 OEM rear spoiler, 15' Dracos, E-codes w/side repeaters, Euro cowl covers paint-matched, Magnaflow 2.5' SS exhaust w/Unitek header
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posted by
someone claiming to be art
on
Wed Oct 20 04:36 CST 2004 [ RELATED]
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If you buy Volvo pads, you get both stainless and rubber-covered shims. I could never learn how they were supposed to be fitted, so I put the textured rubber covered shim against the pad and the stainless shim against the piston. Also note the 20 degree angle of the piston notch is, according to the green manual and one successful job of mine, the answer to squealing rear brakes.
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Art,
I always wondered about that 20 degree angle. I put in new calipers and rotors at the same time and it seemed to work so I never gave it any further thought. Is it always critical to set the piston notch to 20 degrees or just when doing new pads?
Jim
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Jim 90 244DL 245K
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posted by
someone claiming to be art
on
Wed Oct 20 09:53 CST 2004 [ RELATED]
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Jim,
I haven't the foggiest notion if it is "always" important. In fact I haven't a clue how they get out of a alignment; they're so hard to turn...
I'm just paraphrasing the Ken Cook fellows and noting it quieted a set of schoolbus-sounding rear brakes with factory pads about 5 years ago on an '83. I admit that was before the two-piece shims, or at least the shop that installed them didn't use the textured rubber one. I've seen others poo-pooh the whole idea. It is like the P B'laster - if you get the bolt loose once, it is miracle stuff and you'll always use it.
After that, I made a gauge out of scrap metal to check them, and still have to horse them around with a small plier wedged inside the piston-- not very elegant like the fancy tool.
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Tom,
This might work for you.
Go to your local parts store and buy a small pack of Sil-Glyde brake lubricant. Apply a light coat to the back of the pad (where it will touch the shim) and other contact points. However, make sure NONE gets on the pads or rotor or will get on the pads or rotor with use.
I did this when I installed new rear pads 2 1/2 years ago. No noise! Incidentally, I also used PBR pads from Groton.
Good luck,
Jim
--
Jim 90 244DL 245K
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Unfortunately there is only one simple solution: By original brake-pads.
Everything else doesn't work and there is no shortcut.
Volvo have very specific specifications for the brakepads and the "softeness" - and other brands are typically way to solid/hard - thereof the squeek.
/Soren
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