Last month I took my car in for tires and an alignment. I asked that they be properly torqued, 63 ft-lbs. I was assured they would be as the 'torque stick' was used. I left with my wife and kids and we went to get something to eat. Recently, the car began to experience a shaking steering wheel upon applying the brakes. I could only think, overtorqued! I chnaged my oil the other night and sure enough, severly overtorqued. I was able to stand on my Sears breaker bar, 1/2" with an impact wrench socket, and not budge them. Boy am I pissed. I'm not going back to that place again, a nationally famous tire manufacturer in Gainesville Va, for fear they might screw it up even more. Now I might have to replace all the studs and nuts.

Be aware, always check their work. I am reminded of chefs who spit on returned food.

Its sad but you really can't go to a chain type tire shop for anything. I've learned that its better to pay an indy shop with good people an extra 10 bucks/tire to mount and balance...

In the Pacific Northwest, where I live, there is a chain of tire shops known as Les Scwab Tires. I have been doing business with them for about twenty years. They always use a torque wrench to tighten lug nuts, although they leave them set at 85 ft-lbs for all cars. I have never had a problem at the 85 ft-lb setting although I pop the hubcaps off after I get home and re-torque to 63 ft-lbs.

WBain--another tip i do is i remove the center disc on my stock Turbo wheels,, after losing two from a rotate job and 80.00 later, i learn its best to remove and install myself...some of these shops guys just cant get it right..

Maybe you guys oughta get a REAL Volvo (122, 164, etc) that doesn't

care as long as the 1/2" 20 UNF high strength bolts are not twisted

off! I never heard of this problem till the 740s came out! I am

still a little dubious how a brake disk so flimsy that overtorque

will warp it can really stop a car.

OK George, stop gloating. I need to check this, but I suspect the nuts are going bad, not the studs. The brake disc is sandwiched between the hub and the wheel instead of the proper and correct position, bolted to the back of the hub. Since the 70's, car companies have been shedding pounds here and there to increase their CAFE numbers. That was subject a long time ago on OPINIONS.

Your reply reminds me of a time when my parents and I went to Detroit many years ago for a funeral. We took my Mothers Toyota. On the way back, a tire started going bad. We stopped in Breezewood and saw the tire had a really bad case of belt seperation so we needed a new tire. So some young gas jockey came out and proceeded to take the wheel off. He spun his 4 socket universal wrench and it stopped. Then he twisted the stuck nut and bolt right off. I yelled for him to STOP but he started with another. Same thing, spun and it stopped. He did stop that time. After my dad got really POed, the experienced station mechanics did replace two of the bad studs with two new ones, and we got a new tire. From that point on, I had been very careful, since I witnessed total stud failure. I read in one of the car mags about a crash that had happened in a Lexus. The bill came back and was some HUGE amount, covered by insurance, but the wheel studs were about 80 bux. I figured they were made from unobtanium or some such exotic metal like that.

I just had my windsheild replaced and I can see now. The old one was badly pitted. The installer and I, a buddy of mine, were talking and he said that quite a few cars now are using the windsheild as a structural member of the car. The A-pillars are not as strong as they used to be, but he said the 700's did not use this 'technique'. The Explorer we had a few years ago would emeit the worst cracking sound, from the windsheild.

The brake disc is sandwiched

> between the hub and the wheel instead of the proper and correct

> position, bolted to the back of the hub. Since the 70's, car

> companies have been shedding pounds here and there to increase their

> CAFE numbers. That was subject a long time ago on OPINIONS.

I have a couple of experiences with the maintenance unfriendly design of the disc bolted to the back side of the hub, rather than the front side. I prefer the disc installed over the studs. When the disc is installed on the back side of the hub, as on some some 4X4s, the car becomes very labor expensive to do brake work on. You should stop by and help the next time I replace the rotors on my Toyota FJ60. I might add that the Plymouth mini-van which my wife used to own had the rotors installed over the studs, and that design on mini-vans worked well and had no reputation for brake shimmy.

When I worked for Hyster, they bought the drive axle assemblies for one series of lift truck from Rockwell. The brakes were drum brakes on a full floating axle, and the early design had the drum installed on the back side of the hub. The later design axle had the drum installed over the wheel studs, which meant considerably less labor to do brake work.

I just tell them that I want the wheels "hand-torqued" to 63-ft lb, that brake rotor warping is a major problem with these cars, that if they use an impact wrench they will definitely warp the rotors, and that if the rotors warp I will hold them responsible. I also make sure they write "hand torque to 63-ft lb" on the service order. That usually motivates them to both use a hand wrench and make sure the tech takes the time to do the job. You are not popular, but then the rotors are yours, not theirs.

...And then after that, stand and watch them as they re-install the lugs, just in case they need a reminder. I always do that.

It's truly scary how many maintenance techs there are who simply have no idea how to use a torque wrench. As we know, the reading or setting on the wrench is only valid if the wrench is MOVING.

I can't tell you how many times I've seen these people tighten lugs with the impact wrench, THEN use the torque wrench. Of course, when they apply force to the wrench, it clicks. Well, a nut that's torqued to 140 ft/lbs will still make a wrench with a setting of 63 click, right?

Sorry. You guys touched a nerve. I had to vent.

I can totally relate to the post about re-torqueing the lugs when you get them home. I do the same thing. More power to you.

What a bummer. Have you used the candle wax trick to loosen them up?

Mine get torqued to 80 lb-ft, after anti-seize applied. I have used Discount Tires for 15 years, always a good result, even when dollars were scarce and used tires a must. (Only Discount would even sell used).

Good Luck,

Bob

:>)

I am so untrusting that I will go home, loosen all nuts and retorque to spec. People look at you as if you are crazy when you say no more than 66 lbs. Bunch of butt heads in the world----

dick

Bummer, I don't know how you could have any recourse on that.

On the rare occasion that I have a tire mounted in a shop , I hand them my torque wrench pre-set and stand over them while they do it.

most of the time they don't even know how it works or what it is for and I have to explain it to them.

After 2 sets of bent rotors on other vehicles , I don't take chances anymore.