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Need to do an oil change, already bought some conventional Castrol GTX 10w-40, just wondering what you use?
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I just picked up some 0-40w Mobil 1 and matching filter, my first synthetic oil purchase.
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M1 10W30 HM, Mann W917, Donaldson 550008 (remote mount). B230F in both cars. No oil consumption, no issues. 5,000 mile OCI. I have over 50 quarts at $2/qt from AZ close out so I'll be running it for a while yet.
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Pennzoil Ultra Platinum Full Synthetic 5W30 SN Motor Oil, 5 qt - Walmart.com-good price and very dependable
--
89-740 GLE_91-940 Sedan _98-V90 Wagon_2001Mazda626
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Just wondering, do you get much valve train noise with the light (5w-30) oil?
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In a 960, I run 10w30 mobil 1. Could probably run 5w30 in winter but have never seen the need
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In the 1993 240 Classics I run Valvoline Premium Blue 10W30, Delo XLE 400 10W30 or M1 HM 10W30 and change every 3-4k. Mann W917 and Donalson P550008 filters.
In the 2007 V70 2.4L i run Petro-Canada Duron 0W30 and change every 4-6k. Mahle OE filter.
I have two Classics 140/1600 and 1446/1600. :)
Sam
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The last 3 oil changes were of Tractor Supply Co. Traveller Heavy Duty 15W-40 conventional oil. So far, so good with this oil. It's made by Warren, the same folks who manufacture lubricants for several private brands, as well as the Department of Defence. I picked up a gallon several weeks ago on sale for $10. I have used Phillips Super HD II, Shell Rotella, Castrol GTX Diesel, and now TSC Diesel over 32 years of oil changes. Old 240s still rock and roll!
Andrew
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Walmart synthetic. $17 + change for five quarts. Change it every 5000 miles or as soon after that as possible. Been using it for several years now in my V70 2.4 NA (225,000 miles) and wife's S80 2.5T (160,000). Happy to report all connecting rods are still on the inside of both engines.
--
Current rides: 2005 Volvo S80 2.5T, 2003 Volvo V70 2.4NA, 1973 Volvo 1800ES (getting ever closer to road worthiness)
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Cheapest 10W 40 or 10W 30 and a nice Mann filter. Main reason for my ambivalence...outside of single-weight oils for small engines it has been at least 4 years since I say an SL or earlier rating on an oil. The SJ standard basically covers all you need to know unless you have a severe stressor like a non-water-cooled turbo or you operate consistently in temperatures above 115f in stop and go traffic.
I do agree that the need to clean the flametrap, hoses and potentially the oil separator goes down significantly if full synthetic is used but my oil change intervals are time based anyway due to the low driven miles per year.
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I only use sybthetic,,best not to risk a blown bearing or clogged passage,,get rid of the conventional.& get a good synthetic,,Mobil 1 or amsoil..make the engine last longer these engine deserve it..
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I use Dino oil that works in my motorcycle.
I use Diesel 15w-40 oil.
A couple reasons:
-It's cheap and efficient to change every 5k miles. $12 for 4 quarts.
-It does *not* have friction reducing additives that would damage my wet-clutch in my motorcycle.
-It's available everywhere.
-My car is turbocharged, and supposedly the additives work better for the turbocharged engines.
-It starts with a thicker base weight (15) and so needs less viscosity modifiers to make it thick. A 5w-40 oil will need more, just for example, because the oil starts off at 5w. This is *not* a problem where I live because the temperature never gets low enough that 15w is too thick for cold-starts.
-Did I mention it's cheap? :p
There was some interesting stuff from BobIsTheOilGuy, but I forget where I saw it. It may be listed in the FAQ.
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posted by
someone claiming to be jwalker
on
Sun Sep 18 06:42 CST 2016 [ RELATED]
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The 5 (850 and newer models) cylinder and 6 (960 and newer models) cylinder engine's are quite different than the b230f 4 cylinder engines in the 240, 740 and 940 models. The 5 and 6 cylinder engines (basically the same engine except for one cylinder - it is a modular design) are DOHC all aluminum engines. The breather box and EGR in these engines tend to clog if using Dino oil. Then they will leak and cause other problems. I suggest synthetic for your engine. If the seals leak at first, hang in there. The leaks will subside. The leaks are just the synthetic cleaning the Dino oil gunk off its seals.
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We have been using Mobil 1 for many years. I change oil every 10K miles and Mann filters every 5K miles. The reason I use this oil is because it is about as cheap as dino oil changed every 3K-5K miles and I don't have to be under the car in January or February here in MN pulling the drain plug and waiting for the containers to empty. Also, the seals last much longer with the synthetic oil. We have 3 of our 8 940s with over 200K miles and the rear main seals just leak a drop or two overnight compared to quite leaky rear main seals on cars at 100K miles that have had dino oil. I also have synthetic oil in the differentials and the pinion seals seem to last much longer but rust still takes them out here in MN. I mentioned about as cheap as dino because you can get Mobil 1 for $26.99/6 qts.= $4.50/qt. on sale at Costco. So, if changing oil every 3.3K miles with dino oil then the Mobil 1 is 10K miles/3 times as long = $3.33/qt. equivalent.
--
Mine:4-940s running, 2-740, 1-940 parts, dtrs:4-940s
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I've been a fan of Mobil1 for many years. I get improved mileage with it and reduced engine wear. I used to race in SCCA and when I'd tear into an engine that ran this stuff I had to organize parts carefully because they'd look new after removal. On my road cars I consistently see a jump in mileage after a couple of oil changes. I've swapped many cars over to it and only one experienced increased oil leaks and, I believe, it had to do with the poor condition of the engine when it was swapped over.
Cost is not an issue. WalMart keeps it at a price point that's competitive with regular oils if you buy it in the 5 gallon containers.
Mobil1, hands down.
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One addendum: Even if the seals start to leak after the change-over to synthetic, with a little time the leaks will disappear. The synthetic cleans the built up crud (including conventional oil) off the seals. Once the seals are clean their sealing function returns. I have seen this occur on one of my cars.
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hi kitty grey- interesting comments about oil and the m47 ll. i think manufacturers disdained the use of 10- 40 due to its additives and zddp which foul cats and would lead to expensive turmoil if your state has mv inspections. since you and i are notorious frugal fellows would you stick to 10-30 like me? my 245 has 240k , m47 doesnt leak and no noise. but its days may be numbered. always looking for a junkyard replacement as a backup plan. my searches in the se region(fla) find none. further bad news- no success finding a mechanic who can rebuild this trans and has actual experience with the m47. dealer says they have them new for big bucks (2k). seems manual trans mechanics have disappeared. uncle moe said same type of shortage of sherman tank mechanics at omaha beach. moe knew how to weld and fix them and was quickly sent. have you had any luck with the m47. thanks tons oldduke
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Hiya Uncle oldduke,
Hope all's aces for you, Ms. Oldduke, the three pedals in your Volvo 240, and the Florida weather!
Welp, I'd not ever really considered the zddp matter much at all. Though I read, and as you say here, the zddp additive ain't good for the catalytic converter.
No, not Uncle Moe, yet MO-state, what some and I call Misery-state, as it is so miserable, does not test emissions on autos without OBD-II (before 1996?).
We don't care about clean air in MO.
Though, as I want to return to a state with some options like emission testing to know the Volvo 240 does emissions well, maybe a low or free zddp synthetic, if anything exists like that. I dunno. I'll research.
I do know a few repair services in WA and OR, and maybe here in Mizzou-RAH that could repair an M47 is it is an issue with failed seals, and you do not need replacement parts. If needed replacement parts are available. Though gasketing solutions are many. You can still get seals.
The M47 II in kittsgreyvolvo formed a leak. I had to pay for the repair in Spokane. The inner real wall of the gear box has a seal for the shift level selector shaft. Also, the seal between the rear 5th gear splash chamber thing and the rear wall of the gear shaft chamber failed. Works fine now. Shift civilly and smoothly. Has the Redline MTL overfilled in it.
The M47 II in the 1992 240 GL is of concern. The fluid was dark brown with bright silver sparkles in the magnet-loaded fill and drain spark plugs. Also, a gear tooth came out in the oil. I may have posted about it before. A prior owner shifted the thing using a three pound hammer to bang it into gear it seems. I overfilled with the Amsoil Super Shift® Racing Transmission Fluid SAE 10W in late 2007. Runs cool and shift smooth. That 1992 has a funky clutch with a high force clamping quality to it. Easy to use the clutch, yet the clutch is either on or off. They did not prep the flywheel just right. There's a but of judder taking up drive in 1st and reverse. Can't avoid it. No leaks. Though with all the silver and the gear tooth in the oil change, the synchros feel thin. Sometimes, on a slow downshift, you can feel the gear teeth mesh. Worrisome.
The 1990 240 M47 II was also abused. Second gear synchro would do the grind on down-shift and occasional up-shift. A little on third. I overfilled with the Amsoil Super Shift® Racing Transmission Fluid SAE 10W in 2007 or so. No silver, and the old fluid was red. It smelled of mineral Type F and was not burnt. Works fine and runs cool.
None of them make noise from the bell housing area of the gear box. They all run cool. At least no cooler than little more than the hot pavement on a hot day. Else, essentially no extra heat comes of the shift level like they did with the mineral "Type F". They don't leak.
I also keep the clutch adjusted with a little extra free play than spec.
Though I shift gently and rarely floor it at all. Maybe to do a highway merge I'll goose it. I've read the M47 II with aluminum case can flex in a way that effects the third gear the most. Or the gears and bearings under strain in third gear suffer more. Enhancing wear. There is some interesting info to take in at the Turbobricks about the M47.
I've not used the special Volvo gear oil vvpete strongly urges about. Though I'll not use mineral "Type F" or "F/G" unless an emergency, as it happened in the 1991 grey 240 that started leaking 300 miles away from where it used to reat in Spooky-kane (Spokane).
Per your Uncle Moe, what did happen with the Sherman tanks at Omaha Beach if the tanks needed repair. Well, other than Uncle Moe. I guess Uncle Moe repaired a lot of Sherman tanks, then?!?!?!
Why do you say the days of your M47 II are numbered? Is your M47 II okay or making some kind of noise? I hope not!
You can go to the http://row52.com/. Row 52 serves the nationwide collection of Pick and Pull type yards. They may not be accurate on transmission in a 240 or 740. Though I'll guess you can use an M47 II from a 1988 (or 1986+?). Certainly from a 740 and the very few 940s (and other 700 / 900) with four cylinder and M47. You could call and ask. Though buying used is maybe a gamble. I guess get images first?
Maybe you can find a mechanic that can service yours. Yet the spare parts issue is the problem, I read again and again. Lack of bearings and gears and other parts. So, you may need another spare M47 II for the spare M47 II? Yet I'll guess with normal wear or neglect and hard use they wear similarity. I dunno.
I've seen images of a black iron alloy (steel) case M47 II for higher HP applications. Though these maybe in Europe? Maybe Canada? I dunno.
Sorry to go on so.
Thank you,
Monday MacDuffed.
--
Give your brickboard.com a big thumbs up! Way up! - Roger Ebert. 
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hi kitty grey- thanksfor your insights on the m47. so far zero problems or noise with the m47. but it does have 240k on the original trans.i drive it gingerly and am careful. seems though that at some point in time it will blow or leak and then what. remember i always like an alternative plan b ready togo when plan a fails. think a used swap in is best option due to unobtainium parts, no manual trans mechanics left in america and the always growing problem of shysterism.when it craps i will look you up again for your sagery. btw moe was always good for a quote or saying. once he said with the price of everything going up and up you have to give up and up. lucky for you and me he didnt give up when they got off the beach and broke out of the bogage with the shermans. give em hell, oldduke
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Can you still buy replacement differential cover plates? Rust is indeed a real issue.
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Dear Steve,
Hope you're well. The diff cover was part #3549765, superseded to #8250377.
This part should be available from Volvo. MSRP is about US$160.00.
Also needed when replacing the diff cover is Part #974673 (ABS/Speedo sensor "O" ring); MSRP is about US$2.
Hope this helps.
Yours faithfully
Spook
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Muy Estimado Don Esteban,
¡De nada, señor!
Atentamente,
Spook
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From the salvage yard? It's a Dayna (Spicer) diff, so, if not from Volvo, contact Dayna for the type Dayna diff you have.
http://www.davebarton.com/volvorearends.html
http://people.physics.anu.edu.au/~amh110/Diff_LSD/diff_lsd_volvo_dana.htm
Not any info on diff covers, rust or not.
It appears you can purchase new replacements. Chromed, as you please. Though variation by speedo and ABS sensor and goodness knows what else, is a topic for your research.
Try http://www.fertan.com/
Apparently non-toxic and dissolves the rust down to the not so corroded metal. Not a phosphoric acid like Naval Jelly or the POR-15 method. Tho, I dunno.
An FYI.
cheers,
John D. McGurk's Irish Pub, 1200 Russell, Soulard, St. Louis MO.
--
Give your brickboard.com a big thumbs up! Way up! - Roger Ebert.
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I use dino oil - Shell Helix 10w/30 with Mann or Volvo OE filter in my tropical climate.
I figured our B230 engine is sort of old school design which used conventional oil during its inception. It seems well suited to dino oil. I did use semi/full synthetic variety many times ago but noticed a bit of "auto transmission lag" i.e. engine not totally in sync with transmission - engine spins faster and transmission sort of catches up later. Could be specific issue with my ZF 4HP22 I don't know but I'm using ZF approved fluids.
I stopped buying Castrol or some other parts store oils which has dubious security seal. Counterfeit oil is not uncommon nowadays.
Regards,
Amarin.
p/s - To clean the engine's insides MMO is a good choice. Previously I use repeated engine oil flushing method (i.e. use new cheap oil to run in engine, change with another new oil a few days later and finally use your preferred oil) but thats wasteful for the environment. Got similar results with MMO.
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you figured wrong,,Especially for a turbo the the extra qualities of synthetics is crucial,,every gas engine is better maintained w synthetic
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hello marin and other sages- a frequent and probably the oldest question revisited and asked on auto forums. have wrestled with it since 65 when top recommended oil was sae 30 weight high detergency with various additives. valvoline and castrol were top recommended names. multi weight oils were just getting popular. now single weight oils are frowned upon due to slow flow in colder temps and alleged lower mpg due to slow flow. good point about old engines like the 240 using dino oil. more than one sage has told me synthetic oil causes leaks when you switch in old engines used to dino. havent used them . one respected cheapskate wrencher tells me synthetic is ok and better if you use it from the beginning in new cars. this seems like accurate advice since he has done that with 2 new camrys each doing 300k with no engine problems. as one who has read about, wrenched and cussed tanks since before the tet offensive what do i do. most of those years i have used a top rated 10-30 quaker dino, purolator oil filters and regular oil changes(4-5k). current fleet includes a 92 245, 01 saturn and 01 merc marquis. all well past 100k and engines run well. do use 5- 20 in the merc b/c the book insists on it. the volvo engine does stand out though; never add oil between changes, good mpg 25/30,no leaks and seems tight and strong. volvo book calls for 10-30. dont see much single weight oil any more. think that is relegated to racing flatheads on dirt tracks. feel free to criticize my analysis. thanks tons oldduke
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Oil leak was never an issue when I was using synthetic. The transmission lag was. Owners of cars in colder climate may consider using synthetic for that quick flow during start-up.
Yes Volvo engines especially B230 don't require adding up oil in between oil changes. I figured this is mostly due to its PCV design which recovers oil vapours quite well. My previous Alfa boxer did use up oil - up to 1 litre - in between changes due to oversimplified PCV which sort of free flow in design (valve stem seals and piston rings were ok). But it served the purpose of lowering much crankcase pressure for its high-revving life. This in contrast with our B230 having multi-wall oil separator box. Anyway its a different engine for altogether different driving style.
Regards,
Amarin.
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so amarin- would you switch to synthetic in a b230 engine in a volvo 92 245? mine has 245k. been using quaker 1030 conventional with no oil between 5k changes. never heard the point about the multi walled pcv conserving oil . could you explain a little further.maybe the oil leaking risk is a myth. thanks tons oldduke
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Normally I wouldn't switch to synthetics. But just for the sake of experimentation give it a go. I feel that you're itching to get some new experiences on the car i.e using synthetic oil, soft wall Michelin tyres, LED headlamps and such (anyway I'm just guessing here at best). Thats not going to destroy the engine for sure. Oil may leak but its not the end of the world. And thats repairable by replacing the seals and clearing up the PCV. Or go back to using mineral.
Regarding oil leaks, I recently read some history on the design of RR Silver Cloud III engine. In those days, oil leaks from front and rear ends of an engine was acceptable due to the thrower type of oil seal used. These oil seals didn't use any rubber or felt lining, instead a kind of reverse thread was carefully cut into the front and rear crank covers so that the oil would be directed back into the oil pan by the spinning crank. Of course the covers would have to be designed with tight tolerance around the crank. However, when such car is parked on an incline, oil would seep out passively from the engine. So oil leaks was the norm in those days. Some owners of such cars today would re-machine their crank covers to fit rubber oil seals.
Regarding synthetics, that word has been used to include highly refined mineral oil injected with hydrogen gas which is called the Group III (Hydrocracked Synthetics). The hydrogen's purpose is to bind itself to those oil molecules to delay oxidation process (conversely, oxidation is when oxygen binds to oil molecules resulting in sludge formation). Whereas true synthetics has been those from Group IV (PAO) and Group V (Ester) base oils. So be careful which synthetic you'd use in your engine.
Some of the reasons I'm not that much into synthetics is that I can't be sure that manufacturer hasn't mixed some mineral oils into their products unless they're offering only pure synthetic products i.e. no mineral, no synthetic blend in their product line-up. Only very few companies in the world would do that as that could limit their customers in terms of affordability. One of them is Redline.
Regarding the multiwalled PCV system, our redblock is using that now i.e. the oil breather box. The internal walls help to slow down the oil vapour so that much could condense becoming oil again. The Alfa engine I mentioned had no such box, the oil vapour would be piped back straight to the throttle body to be burned.
Regards,
Amarin.
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Hi Amarin. I know all about those oil control grooves machined into the ends of a crank. When I was still in Aviation Maintenance school I rebuilt the 4 banger in my '62 MG Midget, and the bozo who turned the crank turned that area as well. Needless to say it leaked from them on.
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very good analysis and discussion amarin. i do like to try new things but only when im reasonably sure they are better or what im doing isnt working too well. the red block is a fine engine . the only engine in the last 50 years ive experienced that is as durable, economical and long lasting as it is the chrysler slant six which was made from 60-87. strangely both engines are slanted long strokers. seems the only maintenance on the redblock pcv is to clean it periodically. how do you do it and how often? thanks tons oldduke
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The redblock PCV system starts from the breather box up to the small cup with the plastic sieve. Maintenance is quite straightforward with yearly dismantling (in my case), cleaning parts with carb cleaner then put them back in. The hidden aspect of maintenance is that some of the components do age with time and need to be replaced maybe once in a few years.
The oil breather box is bolted down to the engine with an O ring. Last time (I can't remember how long ago) a black O ring was used but now a green O ring is provided instead which lasts longer up to 5 years. Some mechanics like to use RTV to provide more box to engine sealing at this ring area but I find it difficult to remove them in future maintenances. More alarmingly bits and pieces of RTV could fall into the black plastic tube down into the oil pan. Just lubricate the ring with some engine oil is sufficient I think.
Rubber hoses upwards from the breather box is friction fitted to the small cup with the sieve. The short hose from breather box to the small cup should last up to 5 years. Do not keep on using this hose with Jubilee clips/cable ties fixing it between the box/small cup. If hose's friction fit is gone replace with a new hose. Friction fitting is part of the safety design to blow the hose out in case of severe small cup blockage. Another pitfall is that the small cup's vacuum nipple do age and could break if not handled gently. A readily available spare is advised whenever one dismantles the system for cleaning.
I did find one modification to the PCV system which is to enlarge the breather hole in the small cup. I referring to the hole directly underneath the plastic sieve. Using some suitable tool (I used my soldering iron last time) the size/opening of the hole could be made larger a bit. This helps in reducing the blow-by gas pressure in the engine. Try it and see. You could always go back to the standard hole by using a new cup anyway.
Thats about it I think.
Happy motoring,
Amarin.
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For our fleet of 940 turbos and one 740 NA, we use full synthetic 5W-30, whichever brand is one sale at NAPA, Walmart, et al, all with Mann filters. We change at 7,500 miles given the mostly city driving we do.
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