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Harmonic balancer slipping... How do you tell???? 200

uid 33936's pic
posted by  TheBrickTank on  Thu Aug 29 15:15 CST 2013
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last visit: Thu Oct 23 17:54 CST 2014
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All,

I'm having issue with my charging system. The car is a 1989, 245, with 320K on the clock.

This problem has been happening for some time now (about 10 months or so), and at first I was leaning towards a bad alternator so I replaced the regulator. No change in the problem.

The battery shows about 12.10 volts while running and no change during acceleration.

All the contacts are good on all the wires. At the alternator +/- terminals I should be getting 14.4 volts, but I see only a steady voltage of about 12.05 volts.

The positive terminal on the battery to the positive terminal on the alternator reads .016 volts

The negative terminal on the battery to the negative terminal on the alternator reads .014 volts

The negative terminal on the battery to the engine block is well be 2 volts, actually, its well below 1 volt.

So I've been able to rule out I believe everything but the harmonic balancer (i.e. crankshaft pulley).

How would I know if it is indeed slipping? Timing Light? Would this be the symptoms that I'm seeing here? I need to track this down and fix it as it is affecting my gas mileage. Can the alternator not charge a battery if it is say below a certain voltage? If so, would charging the battery up fix this issue?

As always, any and all thoughts are welcomed and encouraged on this topic.

Thanks in advance,

Matt







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    Harmonic balancer slipping... How do you tell???? 200

    uid 33936's pic
    posted by  TheBrickTank on  Fri Aug 30 19:43 CST 2013
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    last visit: Thu Oct 23 17:54 CST 2014
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    Fixed it today with another Alternator.

    I'm now seeing 14.4 volts at the alternator and about 13.6 volts at the battery.

    Now all I have to do rebuild that old one so that I have spare just laying around.








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      Harmonic balancer slipping... How do you tell???? 200

      posted by  machine man on  Fri Aug 30 23:24 CST 2013
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      last visit: Wed Oct 22 15:40 CST 2014
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      Keep looking as there should be a reason for the voltage drop. Eight tenths of change, should have a reason to be!
      Were the lights and fan on? If it was holding the 13.6 volts then it might be ok!
      If the battery is not fully charged then it might explain the absorbed or absorbing difference in voltage. The battery is can still being a sponge of "wanting."

      What kind of voltage readings are you getting when measuring for voltage in-line with the cables now? I am curious of what got cleaner or connected better.


      The regulator responds with good amounts of current with only a couple of tenths in system voltage variance.

      The whole cars charging should read the same within only a couple of tenths of a volt from the alternator to the battery.

      Did you have the old alternator tested by a shop that actually puts on a variety of loads on it with their machine?

      It still might be good and a bad connection or cable could still be lurking around to raise its ugly head again!

      I use to kiss things off quickly, in a love affair with my work, to find it was a sloppy "affair," after all!
      (:-o)
      Phil








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        Harmonic balancer slipping... How do you tell???? 200

        uid 33936's pic
        posted by  TheBrickTank on  Sat Aug 31 05:16 CST 2013
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        last visit: Thu Oct 23 17:54 CST 2014
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        Phil,

        Just came in from reading the charging voltage at the battery.

        I turned off my lights and fan which was on low speed.

        The voltage is not at 14.23 volts. How is that for you?

        Let me know.

        Matt








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        Harmonic balancer slipping... How do you tell???? 200

        uid 33936's pic
        posted by  TheBrickTank on  Sat Aug 31 04:38 CST 2013
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        Phil,

        You're killing me, but I do appreciate the help.

        I took that last measurement of 13.6 at night with the lights on. I will do it again today and post back.

        I do want it correct, not just appearing correct.

        Thanks,

        Matt








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    Harmonic balancer slipping... How do you tell???? 200

    posted by  machine man on  Thu Aug 29 22:41 CST 2013
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    last visit: Wed Oct 22 15:40 CST 2014
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    BAD CABLES AND CONNECTIONS!! Check alternator and engine grounds too!

    When checking for voltage with the leads "in-line" with the conductor (cable) you want the reading as close to zero's across as you can get!

    A zero point two is a very high reading. 0.2. You want another zero like 0.02. If you had what I think you wrote 2.00 volts you have 100 times more resistance of corrosion or bad strands of copper not working against you. It's like having the battery sitting in a car in next block and you are asking for a jump.

    The more voltage you see along either cable the more "that" cable has resistance to current flow.

    Example is, when you read across the battery with only your meter this is in effect an open circuit. The meter is or is acting as a very high resistance to current flow! That is why the meter reads 12.6 volts on a good battery. A few tenths drop in that battery voltage represents the battery's capacity or total amount of ump it can give. By 12.00 volts voltage you can kiss that battery off as dead. All you got is a cigarette lighter there, nothing for spinning over a car nicely!

    Same goes when measuring in parallel with a conductor. A few tenths of a volts reading means big trouble! That is how you are poking around at hundreds already!

    Power, In and Out of the battery is a two way street. Hey buds, you got more than pots holes beneath your boulevard rider! (:-)
    Phil







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    Harmonic balancer slipping... How do you tell???? 200

    posted by  pageda on  Thu Aug 29 15:47 CST 2013
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    last visit: Fri Oct 24 13:18 CST 2014
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    Paint a line across the 2 metal sections of the HB, if the line separates you know.
    Dan







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      Harmonic balancer slipping... How do you tell???? 200

      uid 33936's pic
      posted by  TheBrickTank on  Thu Aug 29 17:37 CST 2013
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      last visit: Thu Oct 23 17:54 CST 2014
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      Did the paint test and no separation, so I will rule out the harmonic balancer.

      I have another non-driveable 240 sitting in my garage that has a working alternator. Plan to swap it out tomorrow and see if that works.

      Thanks,

      Matt








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    Harmonic balancer slipping... How do you tell???? 200

    posted by  Philip on  Thu Aug 29 15:21 CST 2013
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    last visit: Thu Oct 23 10:21 CST 2014
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    Recently replaced the harmonic balancer on our 240. One symptom was a squeal when the AC was turned on. However, it was obvious when I turned on the AC, revved up the engine and looked at the belts, they were barely moving.







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