Volvo RWD 140-160 Forum

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142E brake questions 140-160

Finally found a flat spot so we could jack up the July acquisition and look at why things squeek so much.
What can be seen is all four wheels are Girling. All four rotors are shiny and without grooves or any obvious damage. Every set of pads however looked very different. Only one wheel had even wear and plenty of pad. One front had a pad at a severe angle and it didn't want to move. (See picture)
Several issues-
1) the rear calipers don't really return. Am suspecting hoses need replacing, as when the bleed valve is open, the pads can be levered away from the disc.
Any recommendations on sourcing these?
2) the right front caliper had one pad worn to an angle and it seems wedged, such that it doesn't lever away from the disc.

Any wisdom on these issues or advice in general on sourcing the bits?
Pad material?
Do shims really make a difference? This car braked and sounded ok until the squeek made us park it and find the flat spot, and it doesn't have shims.

Any particular fluid type seem better on something this old?

Thanks!









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    142E brake questions 140-160

    So it has taken a month, and I have exhausted the online parts catalogs for the rear brake pads for this car. IPD sent me their Girling rear pads, and they are way longer than what comes out of this car. The rear calipers have the logo with the arm gripping the circle- so Girling.
    The pad that came out is 2 3/16" deep and 2 1/2" long.
    That pad has a Volvo logo and these numbers- DB 862 EE And then 4462.01
    Anybody with any clues?
    Thanks!








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      142E brake questions 140-160

      The OE pad for ATE calipers is indeed longer than those for a Girling, but not a lot; should be less than a 10th of an inch difference. I'm with Eric... what part number did you order? And for that matter, what did you receive?

      BTW, did you check RockAuto? They currently have Centric C-Tek semi-metallic rear pads for $8.94 a set (p/n 10200440 for Girling). Hard to beat that price, and they'll last a little less than forever on the rear of the 140.
      --

      Gary L - 142E ITB race car, 73 1800ES
      YouTube Racing Videos








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      142E brake questions 140-160

      Can you please post which part number you ordered from IPD?
      --
      Eric

      Hi Performance Automotive Service (formerly OVO or Old Volvos Only)

      Torrance, CA 90502








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        142E brake questions 140-160

        Eric- sorry to be so tardy in reply.
        The IPD number for the rear Girling pad that did not fit is 100793
        This is a pad way to big.
        Their number for the front Girling caliper that did fit is 100797

        IPD credited the order, and gave me other sources when they couldn't match my pictures.

        Have ordered hoses through Rock.
        Thanks!








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          142E brake questions 140-160

          Have completed brake issues. Turns out every source that listed complete calipers for the 142E could not perform. Did full rebuilds on all four wheels.
          Same was then true of usual sources of booster rebuilds. The folks in Portland won't do those that have the crimp on both sides of the seem.
          In the end took a unit from an S70 with it's master. Small adapter plate and now it stops very nicely with light effort and decent feel.
          Lots of labor. Six hoses major expense.

          Still have original booster so can be put to original in future, but still working through rest of safety issues- need takeup reel for driver's belt, and sorting the horn wiring and it'll be right.








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            142E brake questions 140-160

            I am glad to hear you have straightened out your brake issues.

            But I normally have the calipers rebuilt in stock and I have no trouble supplying rebuilt or new brake boosters for your car. I even have braided steel brake hoses as well.

            IIRC, the seat belt retractor mechanism is the same for a lot of years of Volvos. The main difference will be the latch style and attaching hardware. You will just need to have the belt materiel replaced while having the correct hardware transfered.
            --
            Eric

            Hi Performance Automotive Service (formerly OVO or Old Volvos Only)

            Torrance, CA 90502








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    142E brake questions 140-160

    Don't use any cleaners or oillls. Only use garden hose with full force. Brake fluid is soluble in water. If there is oil or grease build up on exterior use can of brake clean before dismantling








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    142E brake questions 140-160

    So to summarize so far-
    This could be internal clogging or degradation of the hoses, or sticky pistons.
    And the process is replace the hoses- relatively simple but expensive (six hoses!)
    and see.
    Or rebuild the calipers- more dirty and detailed, and the parts aren't cheap when you can find them, or they are far away (at least from California) and see.

    Along with the possibility that it will take all of this to get good working brakes.

    So it seems like the hoses are pretty available- lots of sources on RockAuto, but rebuild kits not so much.

    And it looks like the web wisdom is clean everything and use penetrating oil/chemicals before taking anything apart.

    Again, any favorite suppliers/vendors?
    Thanks!
    Patrick








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    142E brake questions 140-160

    If you do the calipers yourself dont split them. Nearly all fixed calipers will leak at the quad ring even when new rings are used. Google Girling fixed calipers for details on o/haul, they are not difficult.








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    142E brake questions 140-160

    ...when the bleed valve is open, the pads can be levered away from the disc..."

    Aside from possibly needing new hoses, if you have to "lever" the pads away from the rotors when the bleeders are open, then it sounds like the pistons are sticking. Once the pedal is released (or the bleeders opened if the hoses are restrictive) the pads should float off of the rotor on their own and allow the wheel to spin freely (except for a very minor amount of hit-and-miss expected pad/rotor contact).


    "...the right front caliper had one pad worn to an angle and it seems wedged..."

    I'm trying to recall how those girling calipers are configured. Do they not have double pistons on each half of the caliper for a total of 4 on each wheel? If so, it sounds like one piston is sticking while its neighbor is moving freely which is causing uneven pressure on the pad, resulting in the pad wearing unevenly.

    It sound like you need to flush the system out and rebuild/replace at least some of the calipers, if not all four. If, after all this, the pads still won't retract when releasing the pedal but will when opening the bleeder, you can delve into the hose replacement. Or maybe just bite the bullet and go ahead and do it. Those hoses are likely 2013-1971= 42 years old.








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      142E brake questions 140-160

      Your symptoms sound more like rubber brake hoses that have choked up inside. This is very common on old cars with old brake hoses. They look fine outside but are swollen and choked up inside. They can pass fluid under pressure so the brakes work, but will not pass fluid when the pressure is released causing the pads to drag. On your front brakes it looks like one of the two circuits is suffering from this problem but not the other. The fact that the pads release when you crack the bleed screw further supports this theory.

      If the pistons in the brake calipers can be pushed back in with some sort of lever, there are no leaks, and the dust boots are intact, then your calipers are probably just fine. I'd replace all the hoses (I think there are 6 of them), flush and bleed the system, replace the pads, and go from there.








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      142E brake questions 140-160

      The fronts do have double pistons on both sides- part of the dual circuit design.
      Any sources for rebuild kits for the Girling stuff used on these 'E'models?

      Is rebuilding calipers just pop out the pistons clean intensively, replace rubber and reassemble? Is there a way to hone these bores with the caliper in one piece?

      Thanks!








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        142E brake questions 140-160

        Stand by with $'s.

        Scandcar.nl has rebuild kits for 19.90 EUR/$26 US.

        Or you can get them state-side through VP Auto parts for about 535 SEK/$81 US.

        Maybe someone else has discovered a more affordable kit that will cross over to the Volvo Girling.

        I have never rebuilt a caliper myself so I'm no help with the procedure.







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