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a 99 T-5 vs a 97 850R A disappoint experience. Advice 850

posted by  someone claiming to be Dick on  Fri Mar 11 23:39 CST 2005 [RELATED]

Took a 99 T-5 wagon off a lot for a test drive. At ten to fifteen miles an hour with three people in it, when I romped on it the car started to pull sideways on drive asphalt as the wheels came loose. You could feel it. Impressed. The next day I test drove a beautifully maintained 97 850R wagon with only 50K on it. Again, with three people, when I romped on it it didn't seem to have much more acceleration than my 97 850 GLT wagon. A long ways from the tires breaking loose like on the 99. I thought the 850R would crawl out from under us like the T-5 did, but absolutely not. My question is: Would a 99 T-5 normally accelerate the way I described, or did it possibly have a performance chip in it or a different torque curve? I can't believe there was such a difference between these two cars. Dick








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    a 99 T-5 vs a 97 850R A disappoint experience. Advice 850

    posted by  james_a_sousa on  Sun Mar 13 13:39 CST 2005
    Author: [PROFILE] [EVERY POST] [THREADS] [BEST POSTS] RSS Feed     [IGNORE ALL POSTS]
    last visit: Thu Oct 23 18:51 CST 2014
    [RELATED]

    Good tires and traction control can make a BIG difference.

    With Prada spec 2 tires on our Volans, our R is quite polite for the first 50 feet or so. Shut off the traction control and it is a completely different brick.

    I was very surprised how well the traction control works on snowy roads as well, even if I boot it. Believe it or not, this is the first Volvo that my wife likes to drive in winter.

    Interestingly, if BOTH front wheels spin, you can keep them spinning even with the traction control on. I can spin our winter tires from a standstill on dry pavement any time I want - I cannot do this with the much wider summer tires. (I really don't do this too much, from fear of damaging something)

    I would be interested to know what tires each car had. Perhaps the owner of the 99 did like I did for a month or so last fall with our 744 TI - I ran narrow, low tread tires and experimented with sliding the car around under different conditions! It WAS fun and I didn't get any tickets.
    --
    '96 855R, 95 855, '95 854, 90 744TI 377,000 miles on 7 bricks








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      a 99 T-5 vs a 97 850R A disappoint experience. Advice 850

      posted by  someone claiming to be 96 on  Sun Mar 20 11:48 CST 2005 [RELATED]

      i also have yoko-parada spc2 on my 850r, but the trax control is defeated when ur heavily footed. it's only functional under 15mph under light throttle.

      back to the topic, the R is a good all around car but not a rwd-muscle sedan. for that you'd be happier with a benz e500 or caddy cts-v.








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      a 99 T-5 vs a 97 850R A disappoint experience. Advice 850

      posted by  someone claiming to be 96 on  Sun Mar 20 11:48 CST 2005 [RELATED]

      i also have yoko-parada spc2 on my 850r, but the trax control is defeated when ur heavily footed. it's only functional under 15mph under light throttle.

      back to the topic, the R is a good all around car but not a rwd-muscle sedan. for that you'd be happier with a benz e500 or caddy cts-v.








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      a 99 T-5 vs a 97 850R A disappoint experience. Advice 850

      posted by  jrothe on  Mon Mar 14 16:39 CST 2005
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      last visit: Thu Nov 13 05:10 CST 2008
      [RELATED]

      I'm with James on this. Tires will make a huge difference in that torque steering effect that you described.

      When my car was wearing its original, OEM, long-mileage Michelins, the steering wheel would dart all over the place when I accelerated through 1st and 2nd gears. As soon as I switched to a tire with a softer rubber compound -- meaning less tread life and better "stick" to the pavement -- the dartiness to the steering under hard acceleration was almost entirely eliminated.

      I can't speak to the engine differences from experience, but I suspect that they're minimal.

      Differences in gearing may account for much of what you experienced. I don't know where you might find a listing of the different gear ratios and differential ratios between the two years, but that could explain much of what you measured with "the ol' butt dyno."

      --
      Jim Rothe, '99 S70 T5M,
      http://www.jimrothe.com/volvo/index.html








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        Most Year to Year Differences 850

        posted by  Catmonkey on  Tue Mar 15 00:14 CST 2005
        Author: [PROFILE] [EVERY POST] [THREADS] [BEST POSTS] RSS Feed     [IGNORE ALL POSTS]
        last visit: Tue May 15 17:44 CST 2012
        [RELATED]

        Here's a good resource for this sort of information:

        http://engphys.mcmaster.ca/~bill/volvo/database/cars.htm
        --
        In the Country of the Blind, the One-Eyed Man is King








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          Most Year to Year Differences 850

          posted by  jrothe on  Tue Mar 15 03:15 CST 2005
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          last visit: Thu Nov 13 05:10 CST 2008
          [RELATED]

          Hmmmm... identical transmissions and gear ratios -- so much for that theory!

          --
          Jim Rothe, '99 S70 T5M,
          http://www.jimrothe.com/volvo/index.html








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            Most Year to Year Differences 850

            posted by  Catmonkey on  Mon Mar 21 15:00 CST 2005
            Author: [PROFILE] [EVERY POST] [THREADS] [BEST POSTS] RSS Feed     [IGNORE ALL POSTS]
            last visit: Tue May 15 17:44 CST 2012
            [RELATED]

            Here're a couple of quotes I found on the Volvoclub UK website's "850 register" page that appear to indicate that the opposite of what you experienced is the norm. Of course the comments may only pertain to UK vehicles.

            "The main problem I have found with the 850 T5 is the ease that the front wheels can be spun, especially on wet roads. It takes great care to pull away briskly and maintain good grip. It is also the cause of rapid tyre wear on the front wheels. This was addressed in the V70 T5 by re-mapping the power output so that the main power came in a little later and allowed the car to move away under better control to start with."

            and

            "The newer V/S70 models are fitted with a 'fly-by-wire' system whereby the accelerator does not have a cable, but has an electronic link to the engine management system. Neat. But some of these models have a known problem. I don't yet have details of the range of cars, but it may only be the turbo models. I mentioned this in my last report. There is a lack of power when moving off from rest. Volvo now has new software to fix this problem, and it is covered by warranty."
            --
            In the Country of the Blind, the One-Eyed Man is King








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    a 99 T-5 vs a 97 850R A disappoint experience. Advice 850

    posted by  someone claiming to be guest on  Sat Mar 12 08:04 CST 2005 [RELATED]

    the r models do have more hp and torque but the ecu limits how much power the car is able to produce when accelerating from a stop so that it does not over power the tires. you can really feel the difference in the factories chip tuning when the rpms get a little higher








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    a 99 T-5 vs a 97 850R A disappoint experience. Advice 850

    uid 16216's pic
    posted by  NBZ on  Sat Mar 12 02:33 CST 2005
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    last visit: Thu Feb 2 21:31 CST 2012
    [RELATED]

    Hey Dick,
    My 94 T-5 will almost pull the wheel out of my hands under hard acceleration.
    An 850R is rated at higher torque/hp, so I would suspect that there is a lag somewhere on this R. Could be any number of things from vacuum to throttle body to turbo...
    Armie
    --
    '94 850 154000kms '86 760GLE 272000kms








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    a 99 T-5 vs a 97 850R A disappoint experience. Advice 850

    posted by  bill d cat on  Sat Mar 12 02:33 CST 2005
    Author: [PROFILE] [EVERY POST] [THREADS] [BEST POSTS] RSS Feed     [IGNORE ALL POSTS]
    last visit: Mon Aug 11 04:23 CST 2014
    [RELATED]

    The cars weigh about the same. Did the 3 passengers weigh the same? Also, if the '97 had TRACS and the '99 didn't that might explain.

    Or the wastegate might not be correctly adjusted on the '97.

    -BTC







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    a 99 T-5 vs a 97 850R A disappoint experience. Advice 850

    posted by  someone claiming to be Ben & Jen on  Sat Mar 12 01:56 CST 2005 [RELATED]

    Or maybe something is wrong with the "R"

    We have a 97 "R" with 60k on it and a 01 T-5 with 35K on it and there is no way the 01 will out run the 97 on first gear (both of them are automatic). I will admit that the ride is much better on the 01 but the "R" still feels faster as it takes off with more power.

    '97 850 R (60K miles) & 01 V70 T-5 (35K miles) = Ben & Jen







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