Hello All,

I have a a 1999 V70 AWD XC wagon with 210,000 miles. The catalytic converter is failing (it triggered a Check Engine Light). Volvo no longer sells this part (Part # 8603001). The value of my car, though priceless to me, is about $1,000 to $1,500. It is in pristine condition. Through research I have found three alternatives:

1) eEuroparts has a Volvo converter for $1,487.09

2) Magna Flow (based on its website) sells a unit made by it for $727.00

3) Rock Auto has a Bosal converter for $431.79 - per Rock Auto's website, Bosal is an OEM supplier, and I do seem to recall I have seen its name on exhaust parts for some of my other Volvos. Perhaps, it was the OEM Supplier for the converter on my XC?

All the converters are "direct fit" and not "universal units" so they will bolt on directly. They seem to have the same warranty (5 years/60,000 miles) My private garage tells me the aftermarket converters are not as good as the Volvo original converters. Their internal cores are smaller, and they frequently fail within a year or two. Perhaps their short life span reflects their reduced cost.

The idea of purchasing a Volvo converter that exceeds the value of my car does not make economic sense. Yet, the idea, of buying an aftermarket converter that may go bad in a year or two, does not appeal to me either. Yes, there is a warranty, but I am sure it will not include the cost of labor and who needs the headache. I welcome any suggestions or advice. Thank you to you all in advance.

Hugh

Hello All,

I want to provide you with an update to my "CEL" problem described above indicated my catalytic converter was failing. Based upon my last response, I thought I had "fixed" the problem by tuning up the car (including replacing the spark plugs with Volvo plugs & air filter), having the fuel injectors cleaned, having a fuel cleaner installed, and having a can of B44K fuel cleaner installed.

All was well since the end of August till now, 12/23/20 when the CEL came back on again. According to my mechanic, the CEL is due to the catalytic converter. The code that was given (the exact number I do not know) indicates the catalytic converter is not as efficient as it should be in removing pollutants.

At this juncture, I will be ordering an O2 spacer from iPd, Inc. to see if that fixes the problem. While I was inquiring about the spacer, the representative said the reason why my car is having problems with the catalytic converter is because I have been running the car on 87 grade octane instead of 91 as recommended by the owner's manual. This is sobering news for me. When I purchased this car used with 12,0000 miles on it, and attended an "Owner's Open House" at corporate Volvo's office in Rockleigh, NJ. On hand was a Volvo engineer who said, that although I should run the XC on 91 grade, it would not damage it to use 87 grade. So that is what I did. At 163,000 I burn a valve. 20,000 miles later, I burned another valve. Both times I have the all the valves replaced and the head removed and sent out to a machine shop. These repairs were expensive. 8 years ago, I replaced the catalytic converter with a Volvo unit, when the original catalytic converter was damaged due to collison. Now that catalytic converter is throwing off a code that has triggered the CEL that indicates as stated above, the converter is not as efficient as it should be.

At this juncture, I am wondering if it was a huge mistake on my part not to have been using 91 octane all along. I have two '96 non-turbo 850 wagons, that I run on 87 grade without any valve or catalytic issues. Their owners manuals also recommended 91 octane, but I have never had the issues I have experienced with my '99 XC.

I would like to hear from other XC owners what grade of gasoline do they use? 87 or 91? I realize, switching over to 91 octane may be too late, the damage has been done. But I would still like to hear from other owners on what grade of gasoline they use. I may be too late, but I can always learn. Thanks to all who respond.

Hugh

IMHO - Try the 02 spacer as suggested by Klaus. Personally, if I had burned 2 valves I would do the swap to 91 octane. It is more expensive but you will get better gas mileage so that will mitigate the extra cost somewhat. Older engines often require more octane than newer engines. The 91 octane gas should minimize any tendency for the engine to ping or knock.
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Will I buy another Volvo??? We'll see....

JWalker,

I did follow Klaus' advice and had the O2 sensor spacer installed. The CEL immediately went off and did not have to be reset. At this point, I will use 91 grade or higher. In some ways, I am a little late to the game: 210,000 miles, 22 years of ownership and two valve jobs. If my memory serves correctly, the second valve job was performed at 193,000 miles. I hope I have not done any internal damage to the engine or the catalytic converter by the continued use of 87 grade octane. I am afraid I made a choice of a "poor economy" of trying to save money using the 87 grade versus 91. My hope is I am able to put another 100,000 miles on this car without incident.

Happy New Year! Thank yo for sharing your advice.

Hugh

My pleasure, Hugh! Happy New Year and good luck with the car.
Jim
--
Will I buy another Volvo??? We'll see....

I'm in the UK where petrol is hugely more expensive than the USA. Quite why you would use 87 when Volvo says 91, just to save a few pennies, is beyond me. Reap what you sow, chickens have come home to roost come to mind.

Derek,

I think you are absolutely right about using 87 grade octane over 91 possibly being the cause of having to have two valve jobs performed within a 30,000 mile interval. I said exactly the same thing recently when I dropped this car off at my private garage to address the "Check Engine Light". I felt it was a "poor economy"
on my part of trying to save a few dollars every time I filled up this car. I just had an O2 sensor spacer installed for the rear sensor. As soon as the spacer was installed, the CEL immediately went off. The CEL did not have to be reset with a scanner.

At this point of 221,000 miles and 22 years of ownership, I will bite the bullet and begin using 91 grade or higher exclusively. I hope I get another 100,000 miles out of this car with just ordinary maintenance. I hope I have not done untoward damage to the engine and the emissions system based upon of 87 grade. If my recollection serves me correctly, the second valve job was performed at 193,000 miles. I guess I will see. Derek thank you for your advice.

Hugh

87 octane is fine, so long as you do not exceed 4,000 rpm under boost. You have a low pressure turbo that kicks in at 1200 rpm, which means that your compression gets above 11:1. The 87 octane burns hotter than 91 octane, which could have resulted in a burned valve. Using 'hotter' spark plugs can also contribute.

This should not be a problem with the NA engines as the compression ratio is constant.

Go for that O2 spacer in the rear. That will take the sensor out of the exhaust stream and get rid of your CEL. The front O2 sensor is the one that does all of the work anyway.
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Keeping it running is better than buying new

Klaus,

I just had the O2 sensor spacer for the rear sensor installed by my private garage and the CEL immediately went off. They didn't even have to reset the light. At this juncture, I am going to use 91 grade octane or higher. It may be a little late after 221,000 miles, 22 years of ownership and two valve jobs. If my memory serves me correctly the second valve job was done at 193,000 miles. I hope I have not done an internal damage to the engine by the continued use of 87 grade octane following the second valve job. The same concerns apply to the catalytic converter. If I can put another 100,000 miles on this car with just ordinary maintenance, I will be very happy. Klaus thank you for sharing our advice.

Hugh

I have always used weld-in Magnaflow replacements on cars that needed cats. I have an exhaust shop that does good welding, less problems that having to cut rusty bolts and replace flange gaskets when swapping with an aftermarket cat with OEM style pipes.

In the Toronto area, this usually runs $250 installed, but things are more expensive in Canada...

Good luck!

Herb,

Sorry for the delay in responding to your response. Back in early September, it appeared that cleaning the fuel injectors, replacing the spark plugs (Volvo Plugs), and air filter and installing a can of fuel cleaner ( B&G 44K) seems to have solved the "CEL" issue. This this day, the CEL has remained off.

Unfortunately, history may be repeating itself. A CEL came on for my 1996 850 GLT wagon (a non-turbo, with a manual transmission and 355,000 miles). My private garage mechanic is not sure if this CEL is due to a bad O2 Sensor or the catalytic converter. He "refreshed" the OBII system and cleared the CEL. He told me to drive it and see if the the light comes back on again. Hopefully it won't but your response and those I have received above may prove very helpful.

Have a Happy Thanksgiving to one and all!

Hugh

You should shop around for parts, I often have luck with Ebay

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Fits-2-4L-1999-Volvo-S70-V70-Catalytic-Converter-w-Front-Pipe/223837305432?_trkparms=ispr%3D1&hash=item341dbe3a58:g:qlYAAOSwaRletb2H&amdata=enc%3AAQAFAAACgBaobrjLl8XobRIiIML1V4Imu%252Fn%252BzU5L90Z278x5ickkgCVySCgrNFPU8Iu85TabMOrsLtTl%252F68MsSPNSxpM7qFRoufwzG4kumhcsnL9WP3ie%252FF3Dg3li45zh0mPZ93k0dF9X%252B0dZsM2Fix9nuN%252B5RmCaiBKBxiUVcH5QpF6zTsHZ3QWzk1JjujYiBg%252F%252BWJCL%252FylOZCbdk0CShokbYBF0SRZpKsrYi8JYJVcaZlYyoPUDHkSDiit3IYI5mSFdwTaVkMuUncN6mZvqn%252BGeWje%252FjvYStNd8ICMKs8XT5cDjimI6TsQMn4Sew6t2NK93mHtY2MYz3LWbc%252BuWlhLVXjuvoN2o%252BbXRp6xxYZiEnc57qKbIO%252F%252FGVh5ESacXz%252FguMsb87g3TiuSFmgWsM7q1NOUtXAN6%252FBZX8hE8fPhL6KAlAMOyrHv%252BQpTTjJS3eEgG9tfHvr7TJkz0OMTGhOxV6vNGlS3iAtNWi6EF5K18BOUdXIJnvbD%252B4sxYX2NOEePEILw9RXO2omwxZ0wUnUj8tq6H9X9C5hUVh6x%252B9dAE4hzQOhaAC%252BySj8%252BKP6iMpFpd2WHdGmvLyLqe4fJnqqB8TCZlJlzualMx5goTDHKka7Tf766OQ4NCdUBr4kGnn63MYj4sl69oiiZ8MAjl0TuYv6vjRbjPAVgUQT6d5kl7Ufz10N%252BECdSPVZIBY1Jeev%252FXU4PR209UCVjdLj0VBzmcDMW3T7ehsQcbW0ELvi9In%252FHpM4fYkK8vpVxnrQkIwEw1cG4OOVdxT6jEk%252BVupM1vacLiID8GwzKnAY8hFZV%252Brt0hrhVC0wKmu0qz99GukYka%252FVoBd9MNKk7qUnkw1bIhF1Yd%252Fk%253D%7Ccksum%3A2238373054326360bbf669934e288a478624055d2f16%7Campid%3APL_CLK%7Cclp%3A2334524

How about this creepy URL? It probably has my shoe size in it.
$125.03 shipped for the cat converter

Maybe you should just put some black tape over the CEL? :-)

Bill

Bill,

Thank you for your response and advice. Merry Christmas and Happy New Year!

Hugh

Hello All,

I wanted to get to all of you and let you know the outcome (so far) of the "Check Engine Light" which a week ago indicated I had to replace the catalytic converter on my Volvo. Fortunately, it appears I have dodged that bullet. My private mechanic cleaned out the fuel injectors and put a fuel cleaner into the gas tank and cleared the CEL. A few days after he performed this service, I replaced the spark plugs (Volvo Plugs) and air filter. The car was scheduled for this maintenance independently of the CEL being triggered. I replace the plugs and the air-filter every 30,000 miles. I also installed a can of BG 44K Fuel System cleaner. Incidentally, the old plugs were uniformly "tired" in their appearance. They all looked tired (last replaced 30,000 miles ago) but were the same in appearance.

Since my private mechanic cleaned the fuel injectors and installed a fuel cleaner, and the scheduled maintenance I performed, the CEL has remained off now for over a week. I use the car daily. I am very thankful for that outcome. Yet, I am also thankful for the helpful and the thoughtful advice and suggestions that were provided to me. All of you should take a bow. I'll close for now, but again, let me issue a collective "Thank You!"

Hugh

How does the cat trigger a check engine light - are there sensors in the exhaust system beyond the cat?

Could the sensor be bad?

When techs address a code, there is often a decision tree that they follow - some times the issue is upstream of the item that sets the code.

Has your engine been tuned up lately?

Ignition parts and air cleaner?

I would do (or have done) a tune up and then have a dealer tech check the car.

At least, you would have less risk for the new cat.

Perhaps the short life of some replacement cats are shortened by older cars that have other issues.

James,

As I read your response, it warmed my heart. Just before the CEL came on, I was about to tune-up my Volvo. I tune-up my '99 XC every 30,000 which includes replacing the air filter and the spark plugs. I only use Volvo spark plugs. The Volvo just hit 30,000 mile mile interval and as I mentioned I was about to replace the plugs and air filter. When the CEL came on, I assumed it was one of the O2 sensors or vacuum leak. The car runs great, that's why I assumed it was an O2 sensor or vacuum leak.

My '99 XC has two O2 Sensors: one in the front and one in the rear. I believe the front O2 sensor screws into the exhaust manifold. The rear O2 sensor screws in the the rear portion of the catalytic converter (I believe). I have had them replaced from time to time. In fact, as I explained to Klaus above, I always have a front and rear O2 sensor in reserve. I buy only Bosch O2 filters, and mark on the box when I receive them. When a CEL comes on, and I drop my XC off at my private garage, I ask them to use one or both of the O2 sensors (if needed) that I have provided instead of billing me for them. When an O2 sensor is used, I immediately purchase a replacement and record the date that I received it on the box. I don't have the two O2 sensors at hand because they are inside my Volvo at the private garage now. I seem to recall, I purchased one O2 sensor a year ago, and the the other 2 years ago. I can't recall which one was a front sensor and which was a rear sensor.

James, based upon your recommendation, when I get the new Volvo plugs, I will install them and ask my private garage to reset the CEL. I will be very happy and thankful, if CEL was triggered by tired spark plugs and not a failing catalytic converter.

James, thank you for your advice. I will post on this site the outcome of my efforts based upon your advice and Derek's and Klaus's above.

Hugh, could you give us the codes that your mechanic found? Have the O2 sensors been replaced recently? How soon do the codes come back after they have been cleared?

Volvo has very strict pollution code with the early 5 cyl engines using turbos. My 1995 throws a bad cat code if I drive at idle speed for more than 1 minute - nothing wrong with the cat, just the software.

You could look for a sensor spacer, IPD has one. The spacer moves the O2 sensor out of the exhaust stream, making the oxygen levels appear to not fluctuate.
--
Keeping it running is better than buying new

Klaus,

You mentioned the sensor spacer above. Should I purchase two of them (front & rear sensors) or just one for the sensor that is sending the signal that is triggering the CEL?

Thank you again for your help and I repeat that sentiment to Derek and James too.

Hugh

The front sensor, pre-cat, is what your car uses to "fine tune the mixture". You don't want to mess with that.

The second sensor (after the cat. converter) allows the car to measure the efficiency of the catalytic converter since it now has data on exhaust gases both pre and post cat. That is all.

I'm not familiar with the spacer but I presume that the idea is that by pulling it out of the stream you trick it into a more favorable reading; it believes that the cat. is still doing its job, et voila!, no CEL. Bear in mind that if your state inspector is strict they may cry foul if they find that spacer.

Best,
Will
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XC60 / Odyssey

Will,

Thank you. I spoke with my private mechanic yesterday and he was familiar with and had used O2 spacers on other cars plagued by a CEL with success. I live in CT and I believe the DMV is strict. You have to have the emissions tested on your car every two years, by the use of an exhaust wand that is inserted into the tailpipe. I was also told by one of the owners of the private garage that services all my Volvos (4), that CT does not allow the installation of used catalytic converters on cars (with the high price tag of a new catalytic converter I can understand why some people my pursue that remedy). My hope is based upon the advice that has been shared with me, I may escape the expense of purchasing a new catalytic converter.

Hugh

In Connecticut the emissions test for cars 1996 and newer consists of a check for codes and readiness via the OBDII port (plus a "visual verification of the catalytic converter"). 1995 and older cars used to get the tailpipe sniff test but they're now exempt because the state now deems them "classic".

http://ctemissions.com/test-procedures/tests-for-vehicles-1996-and-newer-obd-testing
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XC60 / Odyssey

Just the rear O2 sensor. The front O2 sensor cannot be modified!
--
Keeping it running is better than buying new

Klaus,

You just saved me $29.95 by purchasing a spacer I could not use. Thank you, as always. I spoke to my private mechanic yesterday, and he was familiar with O2 sensor spacers and had used them successfully on other cars that had a triggered CEL.

I forgot to ask for the specific codes my mechanic saw, but in an attempt to potential eliminate the cause of the CEL, he cleaned out the fuel injectors and installed a fuel cleaner into the gas tank. He also reset the CEL and it is now clear. I got the car back yesterday. Presently the CEL is off. I don't plan on driving the car until I can replace the tired spark plugs this Thursday when I received a new set of Volvo plugs. I will also be installing a can of BK44 the fuel cleaner. I put a can in every 30,000 miles when I tune my 850s and the V70 AWD XC. I will also be replacing the air filter. Between the new plugs, air filter, 44BK cleaner and the work my private mechanic provided, my hope is the CEL will remain off. If it doesn't I will purchase the O2 sensor and make a sign of the cross and hope it eliminates the problem. Klaus I will let you and the others who have been so kind and helping in responding to my query, what the final chapter is to my story. I am keeping my fingers crossed I can avoid purchasing an aftermarket catalytic converter. If I can keep driving this car for another 100,000 miles, without dropping any significant money into, other than ordinary maintenance, I will be very pleased.

Thanks,

Hugh

Hugh

Klaus,

As always, thank you for your response. I will inquire about the specific code(s) that triggered the CEL. I have replaced the O2 sensors on this car from time to time. My Volvo is equipped with two sensors: front and rear. I can't recall off hand how long ago a sensor was replaced last. I always have two O2 sensors in reserve so when the CEL is triggered, I leave them in my Volvo so my private garage can use them, instead of billing me, should an O2 sensor be the cause of the CEL.. I only buy Bosch O2 sensors on line. My usual practice is, when I replace an O2 Sensor, I immediately purchase an O2 Sensor for the one that was used. When I receive the replacement, I immediately write the date of receipt on the box. I don't have the two O2 boxes in front of me now (my Volvo is still in the shop), but I seem to recall one sensor was purchased over a year ago, and the other was purchased 2 years ago. I can't recall if they were front or rear. My understanding is, the front O2 sensor that screws into the exhaust manifold has a shorter life span than the rear O2 sensor which is further down stream, I think after the catalytic converter?

I will mention the O2 spacer to my mechanic. A suggestion by James below has given me hope. Just before the CEL came on I was about to replace the spark plugs. I replace the spark plugs every 30,000 miles. I ordered them from iPd but they have not arrived yet. My plan is to install them and ask my garage to reset the CEL light. My hope is the new Volvo plugs (that is all I use) will fix the problem. I guess from my lips to God's ears.

Hugh

Have you tried running some "Techron" fuel system cleaner. Those injectors need a fine spray pattern for complete combustion. You could juzt be suffering from needing your spark plugs changed.

Nahtanha,

Thank you for your suggestion. I will look for that product at my local NAPA store. I do put a can of BG44K fuel cleaner every 30,000 miles, but that may not be enough.

Hugh

Make sure it is Techron Complete fuel system cleaner. That is the good stuff. There are other Techron fuel products so be careful. Available at Walmart as well as parts stores.

The BGK44 alone should be enough. That is the best. I use 1 bottle a year of the Techron at the beginning of winter. It also serves as a dry gas replacement since it absorbs moisture in the fuel system. If necessary, it can be used every 3000 miles I believe.
--
Will I buy another Volvo??? We'll see....

Have you tried running some "Techron" fuel system cleaner. Those injectors need a fine spray pattern for complete combustion. You could juzt be suffering from needing your spark plugs changed.

I'd want to be 100% sure that the check engine light was being triggered by a failing cat. There are lots of other possibilities. Your garage needs to get their sniffer up the tailpipe to check the emissions.
Have them read the codes, make a note of them if any and then reset back to zero. Check any codes to see what they are. Check again later. Reset should switch off the check engine light too. Report back.
Bosal is a known brand. If the cat is a bolt in, replacing it under warranty if it fails should be quick and easy if the bolts are given a coat of ceramic grease. The one on now may have to have the bolts drilled or torched out if it does use bolts.
Are you aware of Robert DIY on YouTube? Depending on where you live he might be able to help.

Derek,

Thank you for your advice and suggestions. I will follow up with my private garage with your questions. One suggestion made by James below resonated with me. I was just about to change the spark plugs. I replace them every 30,000 miles with Volvo spark plugs.

A few days ago, prior the the CEL coming on, I had ordered a set of Volvo spark
plugs from iPd in anticipation of replacing the plugs as soon as the car hit 210,000 miles. They haven't arrives yet, but when they do, I will install them and ask my garage to reset the CEL.

I do have access to Robert's DYI series and will take a look at it. If thanks to your advice and Jim's and Klaus's below I can avoid replacing the Volvo catalytic converter, I will be very thankful. I will post the outcome of my efforts, so hopefully it serves as a guide to others.

Hugh