Volvo RWD 140-160 Forum

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Thermal Timer Question 140-160

uid 5098's pic
posted by  Sil on  Mon Oct 18 04:48 CST 2004
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last visit: Fri Oct 24 07:24 CST 2014
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After my "71 142 stalled, apparently because of a fuel supply problem -- it started right up after I towed it home, wouldn't you know it -- I read up on the fuel sytem in Haynes, and found a reference to the thermal timer. So, I checked the block and found no thermal timer, just a nice clean, threaded hole, plugged at the end, where the TT is supposed to go. Haynes says that to remove the TT you have to partially drain the block, which contradicts George Downs who at some point, I believe, said that the TT is not in direct contact with the coolant. (?)
Haynes explains the function of the TT in relation to the cold start injector very nicely and then says: "When the engine is running and the starter has shut off the valve (CSI) ceases injecting regardless of the state of the thermal timer." Does that mean that my CSI has been non-functional all along and that, although I have had no starting problems so far, I might get them when the weather turns colder? I have found no loose wires hanging around in the area. That, and the fact that the hole is plugged, unless George is right and Haynes wrong, indicates that the car was running well enough without the TT before and after I got it. I don't believe that car is tuned too rich so as to compensate for a non-functional CSI, because the plugs show a normal color.
Last year, Uniberp mentioned that he had dispensed with his TT and had wired his CSI to a switch on the dash. Michael, could you give me a bit more detail about the wiring? That would be an easier solution than having to drill out that plug in the TT hole -- that is, if Haynes is right and George wrong.
Bob S.







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    Thermal Timer Question 140-160

    posted by  Phil S. on  Mon Oct 18 07:25 CST 2004
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    last visit: Fri Oct 24 13:18 CST 2014
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    Bob,

    I believe '72 was the first year with a thermal timer. '71 lays responsibility for the CSV on the ECU and an additional relay.

    In either version, the CSV is powered from the starter solenoid circuit, so it does nothing when the starter is not engaged. The ECU or thermal timer only enable it. A non-functioning CSV cannot cause the car to stall.

    On cars that do have the timer, I've seen it in two locations: 1) in place of the block drain, which is in contact with the coolant, and 2) in the larger threaded hole at the extreme right rear top of the block, which is not in contact with the coolant. I think those are D-jet and K-jet versions, respectively, but wouldn't state that as a fact.








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      Thermal Timer Question 140-160

      uid 5098's pic
      posted by  Sil on  Mon Oct 18 11:28 CST 2004
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      last visit: Fri Oct 24 07:24 CST 2014
      [RELATED]

      Phil, when you say "additional relay" do you mean in addition to the forward one in the row of three on the passenger side inner fender, or is that the one you are refering to?








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      Thermal Timer Question 140-160

      uid 5098's pic
      posted by  Sil on  Mon Oct 18 09:43 CST 2004
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      last visit: Fri Oct 24 07:24 CST 2014
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      Phil,
      What you say jibes with what I see:
      a) That plugged hole where the thermal timer should go looks like it was cast that way, not as if it were drilled out and then replugged.
      b) The two white wires going to the cold start injector appear to go into the fat harness with all the other white wires that go to the ECU.

      What really got me wondering was that the Haynes diagram for the 142, which, btw, is not date specific, shows the wiring for the TT+CSV as a circuit activated through another white wire from the starter. They don't show any tie-in with the ECU except for a white wire going from the starter to the ECU, and I don't have enough electrical smarts to know if that represents the way the ECU controls the TT+CSV.

      No, I didn't think the stalling was related to the CSV. That was simply a matter of no fuel coming through for some other reason I've not yet got to the bottom of. Plenty of fuel coming through now -- temporary bad electrical contact to fuel pump perhaps. I was on a potholed dirt road, so lots of bounce. It did momentarily cross my mind that an over-active CSV could have caused flooding when I tried to restart, but pulling the fuel feed hose showed that the problem lay elsewhere.
      Thanks for the input, you too Michael and anyone else who might yet pitch in.
      Bob S.








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        Thermal Timer Question 140-160

        posted by  Phil S. on  Mon Oct 18 10:57 CST 2004
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        last visit: Fri Oct 24 13:18 CST 2014
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        Bob,

        In the later version you don't have, there's no tie whatsoever between the ECU and the TT/CSV. Don't make yourself crazy searching the Haynes schizmo for one.

        --Phil








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    Thermal Timer Question 140-160

    posted by  uniberp on  Mon Oct 18 05:25 CST 2004
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    last visit: Mon Jan 31 07:08 CST 2011
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    It was simple. The cold start injector runs on 12v direct. Pickup up 12v from the secondary off the starter and run it through a switch on the dash. I was able to run a wire pair through the AC line grommet and insert them into the disconnected TTX connectors, quick an easy. There should be a connection there. That connector did dangle, so maybe it's wrapped up around something, or very likely clipped off. For extra cold weather you can run 12v direct (not starter circuit) and shut it off manually. I did that too at one point.
    --
    '74 145e T-5 'Orange Alert'







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