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Thanks to all who posted and let me know about life spans of various years of 740 turbos. I did some more checking into the mechanic I took the car to by asking a guy I know who runs a Volvo parts place in the city. Anyway, the parts guy knows the mechanic and vouches for his work, honesty, and knowledge. Apparently these guys really do specialize in Volvos and apparently contrary to what's been said here on the Brickboard, turbos by and large are subject to more wear than N/A engines and this guy has seen more than his share of those turbos that have not been as well cared for as most brickboarder turbos are. I firmly believe that for the most part Volvos can be forgiving of some maintainence lapses but turbos operate on such a razor thin threshold that you really can't afford to treat them like crap and not expect problems sometime in the future. Unfortunately I may be paying for the mistakes of the owner before last. Fortunately the last owner (guy I bought it from) was a knowledgable Volvo enthusiast albeit a classic 1800, 122, 544 guy but he still took good care of the car while he had it. It was likely the speed-racer who owned it before him that did the abusing. Anyway, I'm going to get with the mechanic on Monday to nail down a formal estimate of labor, parts, etc, and possibly consider the prospect of putting in a used engine with lower mileage. I'll be sure to keep everyone updated on this saga. At least I feel a little better about the mechanic now, having gotten a good reputable second opinion on this guys work quality. Basically the guy quoted me a lower price initially based on using a head he already had on hand. When those checked out bad he had to start searching with his usual suppliers for a usuable head which of course was going to cost him more than just using the cheaper alternative of what he had available. So, I'll see where it goes from here.
Matt Campbell
inoperable '89 740 Turbo wagon
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posted by
someone claiming to be Al
on
Sun Feb 29 11:58 CST 2004 [ RELATED]
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My 87 230FT went to 247K miles before the turbo seized. At 282,700 miles it developed a rod knock and the motor was replaced with a Volvo Remanufactured motor. The original motor got 3,000 mile dino 10W30 oil changes. Let me add from 125,000 miles on, it had a Saab APC system installed with the boost set at 14.5 psi. The car was and is driven hard with meticulous maintenance done on it. Nothing but Volvo parts are used on it and only Volvo techs or I work on the car.
The new motor is filled with Mobil 1 10W30 (4,000 mile changes) and I only use Volvo(Mann)oil filters. My K&N filter was tossed in the trash and I went back to factory air filters. Too much silicon(dirt)was found in my oil analysis.
I'm only 3800 miles from my 300,000 badge.
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I second your opinion on the K&N air filters. I do use an oil wetted foam filter on one of our cars, as they are quite effective at catching dirt. The paper air filters are much better than the K&N filters in my opinion.
--
john
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FYI: I BOUGHT my 945T (same engine as your 740) with 180,000 miles. The turbo shows no signs of aging, and the engine does not burn any oil. Granted, it has had synthetic oil all its life.
I agree with one of the posts from your previous thread: Sure a turbo Volvo may not last as long as a N/A Volvo. You may only get 500,000 miles out of it before it needs a rebuild -- instead of 800,000 with the N/A.
jp
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'93 945 Turbo ( one kickass family car ! ), '92 Mercedes 190E (my daily driver), '53 Willys-Overland Pickup (my snow-plow truck/conversation piece -- sold to a loving home), '85 Jeep CJ-7 w/ Fisher plow
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I agree with the 245 TIC longevity, I got mine to 340k before selling it to move to a 745 TIC. True it did need a new head after 250k, I really don't know why because I bought it with 220k on the odometer. I would also suggest synthetic oil changed regularly ( every 5k) and moderate normal usage. My 745 has not proven as reliable needing a full rebuild at 185k due to a burnt #1 piston. I have not really tracked down the reason but I believe it was due to oil seal leakage due to a pressurized crankcase after extended boost. If you track down the crankcase ventilation scheme you will notice a hose from the intake manifold to the breather hose. I believe that this hose can result in a pressurized crankcase during extended boost conditions causing main seal leakage, especially at the rear crank seal if you are climbing a long grade. Since I added a PCV valve to this hose, I have had zero oil consumption. I hope that this simple fix has elevated the 745TIC to the reliability of the 245 TIC. It is surprising to me that Volvo chose to save the cost of this valve (under $5 at AutoZone) and risk their reputation for durability.
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You are correct that turbos experience higher failure rates. This situation is largely due to:
-cooling system failures and poor preventive maintenance on cooling systems
-head gasket failure due to high boost pressures
-lubricant problems due to failure to properly change oil or use the correct oil
IF you maintain your cooling system per the FAQ instruction, use synthetic oil, and don't drive it in high boost all the time, then your turbo should last over 200k miles with no troubles.
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posted by
someone claiming to be Alex Z
on
Sun Feb 29 00:06 CST 2004 [ RELATED]
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Well how's this. Since your turbo is being run on the ragged edge of reliability, I'll take it off your hands for you. All you have to do is deliver it to my doorstep. :-)
Having owned two turbobricks myself (both intercooled 240Ts), and two other friends having another two (88 and 89 760s).. all of them in varying states of neglect.. I think that they are pretty well built up. The one with the early style B230FT had some nasty rod knock, but it had also been severely overheated at least twice, and been running uncontrolled boost (probably for quite a while). My wagon had so much nasty buildup that it would blacken fresh oil within a day or two of driving. However the turbo itself was none the worse for the wear (and it wasn't even water cooled)... oh that car was running basically uncontrolled boost too. The turbo was even fairly quiet, until I got close to the fuel cut-off (which was around 16-18psi I believe).
The Volvo turbo drivetrains were pretty tough (especially the B21FTs and the late B230FTs), and are hardly stressed in stock form.. and really are up for a fair amount of abuse.
That said, you can't treat anything like crap and not expect it to bite you in the ass, be it your girlfriend, your dog, your car, your computer, etc.
- alex
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posted by
someone claiming to be Alex Z
on
Sun Feb 29 00:22 CST 2004 [ RELATED]
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Oh, I just read your original post and let me add to the number of people who think your mechanic is full of shit.
My sedan had about 140k miles on it (an even 130psi across all cylinders.. low even for a B21FT.. but still), the wagon had about 260k miles on it (never did a compression check, but it made plenty o power), the two 760s as well.. even compression with about 210-220k miles on them. I R&R'd the head on the sedan because of a stripped spark plug, the wagon never gave me an ounce of trouble WRT the engine, the one 760 blew a head gasket (it was driven at least 20 miles with coolant gushing out of the side), the other one seems fine for now (but a blown head gasket may explain the coolant loss).
Oh what's my point? A blown head gasket, or even a trashed head is hardly terminal. It would take some serious overheating to damage the block. It takes much less effort to damage the head because it's aluminum. Altho core shift has been somewhat of a problem with the 2.3L engines (B23, B230) that's not so much heat related. I spent about $400-$500 on the head gasket job for my car (which included an OEM gasket set, and a set of pricey exh. manifold nuts and head bolts from the dealer). If you do it yourself you'd save a bundle on labor.
Oh, but more to the other point, your mechanic is full of SHIT. If he can't find a good head from a turbo (which I find hard to believe given the supply of junked Volvos), he could just as easily take a head from a non-turbo. They're the same dang heads. The only differences are the exhaust valves and the camshaft. Ideally the head would already be apart anyways as with such a 'worn' motor you'd want to adjust the valves, replace the valve dampers, maybe grind the valves, etc.
And that he's telling you it would be cheaper to replace the motor.. that's just *lazy* (and/or greedy). Pulling the head is pretty simple on a B230FT. Seven hours of labor isn't obscene, but really.. what kind of motor is he getting for so cheap that it would make up for the price difference of a gasket set and a whole motor (not to mention the extra three hours of labor).
But hey, if you want to junk your car with its blown motor.. um. yeah. my driveway's still empty.
And if you think blowing a head gasket at nearly 200k miles is bad (hah), check out what some other people (mid-80s Toyota V6 owners, Ford 3.8L V6 owners) have to put up with.
- alex
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