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Hi All,
A couple weeks ago I posted a message looking for brickster-recommended shops in the Portland, OR area..... many people gave me some good leads (thanks all!!!).
I didn't call every shop that were referred to me, either due to location -I figured it best to start close and look far if needed. But, I did get a couple estimates. As promised, here they are, every shop was told the same info as far as what was needed.
Here's what's getting done:
- all the front oil seals
- timing belt
- motor mounts
- clean PCV system (failed both palm and "dancing oil cap" tests - test info offered to me courtesy of B.C. and Don Foster, respectively. :)
I have the motor mounts, so all estimates are don't have a motor mount part price built in to them - aside from that, all other parts & labor are included in the prices.
All-Around Automotive - when i called this shop, they refused to even give me a ballpark over the phone, asked me "well, how do you know you need this work done? did someone tell you?" also said "just because the engine is shaking doesn't mean it's the motor mounts". best estimate I could get was that they would charge me $40 to "diagnose the problem". note: this shop was non-volvo, recommended by someone not from brickboard.
Eastside Swede - offered to do everything for about 500 bucks, when I said I had the motor mounts, they said they would put 'em on for me just this once, but in the future would not put on outside parts. (motor mount charge alone was $150 from this shop). they may be good, but this is a little spendy for me right now.
Alamo automotive - everything for $300 bucks (actual break-down is $50 bucks to install the motor mounts, and $250 covers seals, t-belt etc.). When I asked about the PCV system cleaning, they said they do that as part of the other work, which sounded good & thorough to me. when i inquired about bringing my own parts, this shop told me exactly which seals to buy, and which not to buy due to a high failure rate. also, since I am poor right now, they told me they could work out a payment arrangement with me as needed - I thought that was really cool, considering they've never even met me before.
(Confidential to Scott C: Mitch says hi to you and Janet :)
so far, Alamo is the one I plan to go to. How does this estimate sound? any feedback welcome.
thanks!
susan.
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Susan -- I'm getting in on this conversation at the 11th hour, so please forgive me if this has been discussed before, but have you considered doing the work yourself? Every one of us on this board started from a position of 'never done it before -- don't know how'. Do you have a friend/partner with some familiarity with cars in general or Volvos specifically who could provide the wisdom/assurance/confidence factor? I work a lot better on a first-time job when I have someone looking over my shoulder who has done it before.
I started out poor at one time and still am, relatively (with two sons in college). I've always figured that for the first job, if I spend the money not on garage fees but on the tools that I need to do the job myself, then I'm ahead of the game the next time I need those tools -- I can then get the job done for free.
In your case, for the motor mounts, you need a nice jack, some ramps (there are other ways, but that's what I use), a set of combination wrenches and a set of sockets, a Bentley's manual, and some hand cleaner. That's about $200 or so investment. But they're yours forever and you'll never have to spend that money again.
Sorry for the philosophy lesson...
Oh, by the way, if you're getting the timing belt replaced (or if you decide to do it yourself!) do the t.b. tensioner as well. If you don't know if it was ever replaced, then get it done for peace of mind.
Good luck!
Rob Kuhlman
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Hi Rob,
Yup, I hear what you're saying.... no need to apologize for the philosophy lesson - you are right on with what you are saying. :)
I do have a Bentley on loan from the Library, and I have a socket set and the hand cleaner too, so that's a start.
The problem is the competent coach - My boyfriend and I have both snooped around in the engine a couple times, but he's not really clear on the whole Volvo thing either.
You don't think these jobs are a little advanced for a novice? I have heard about all the motor mount horror stories, and the IPD catalog points out tha motor mounts are a "level 3" job..... I am somewhere between a "level .5 and level 1".
Here is my total car experience, just to give more insight on my exp.:
a) re-solder overdrive relay (my 1st "major" undertaking)"
b) change the spark plugs & S.P wires - boyfriend coached me and covered his ears while I swore throughout the process, but I did all the hands-on.
c) replace burnt out headlight....yesssssss, I rule!!! (kidding).
d) replace burnt out dash lights, also swearing whole time, ended up making boyfriend finish the job because I was getting really aggravated working upside down under the dash. I think DIY has the potential to turn me into an alcoholic. and I wish I was kidding.
If you (or anyone else reading this) thinks these jobs are A-OK for a novice, & if I could find a good coach who isn't offended by massive amounts of profanity, I may take a crack at it.
Thanks Rob!!
Susan
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Hi, again Susan!
If you can resolder the o.d. relay and replace dash lights while lying on your back, you're doing great! Wait till you get to be my age and you try that lying on your back trick while wearing trifocals. The lenses work the wrong way...
Someone once said if you can do a heater fan motor and do rear trailing arm bushings, you can do anything. Neither of those jobs are particularly hard -- they just take time because there are a lot of steps involved. I sincerely hope I don't offend any of our professional folks with the following statement, but there really isn't much in the 240 which requires brain-surgery type intelligence. It's just common sense and perservance. Where folks make money in the business is that they can do a job in 1/3 the time it would take you and me. Tools accounts for some of that but repetition is a lot as well. The first time I did the motor mounts on my '81, it took me three hours. The next summer, I did them on my '83 and it took an hour and a half. You'll also pick up familiarity and it'll become 'easy'.
Back to motor mounts -- I don't think it's as hard as it's cracked up to be. There are some tight bolts which you need to loosen (PB Blaster works wonders) and you do a lot of running around from underneath to back upstairs to back under again, but it isn't really *hard*. Everything is pretty accessible, and there are a few steps you can take to make your life easier. If you do decide to give it a go, just ask for input. Also -- the timing belt job is easily doable, and putting in a water pump (which may or not be needed) is almost the same job insofar as you need to remove the accessory belts, the fan, and the fan shroud. (These jobs sort of feed on each other.)
One other thought -- I'm from southeastern Penna., but I get to the northwest about once a year (inlaws), and there seem to be a *ton* of Volvos of all flavors in Portland. Over in Vancouver is a fellow who edits the VClassics web zine. Here's VClassic's URL:
http://www.vclassics.com/
Go to that site and send Phil Singher (the editor) an email. Ask if he could recommend a buddy or two who might be willing to look over your shoulder as you do some of these jobs. Phil's one of the 'good people', and I'm sure there are enough friendly 240 folks around that it shouldn't be too hard to get you some mentoring. I bet before you know it you would have a group of 5 folks who get together once a month to drink tea/coffee, chat, and do some wrenching together.
Rob Kuhlman
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Hi Rob,
OK, you've convinced me! Your idea about contacting Phil is a good one, so I will give it a go. I will tell him that you said to contact him, so he doesn't think I am a random lunatic.
side note: I am from PA too - I grew up in Scranton & get back there usually once a year to visit my mom, dad & sisters. I love being from Pennsylvania - the food, the people and the seasons, but I am glad I live here now... it is a nice combination of perspectives. j
Thanks again, and I'll post with results (or more questions).
Susan.
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The price from Swedish Motors seems odd. The last time I had the TB and front seals done on my '82 (all the same parts/labor) it was about $200. I've never done the motor mounts there, but I can't imagine it would be more than $100. I think the PCV stuff was about $50. Also, I've never had them complain about putting on customer-supplied parts. Maybe I get a better deal there than I thought.
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Yep, I was surprised by that shop's pricing, I was expecting a less expensive quote from them, for whatever reason. Did you give me them to me as a recommendation? I said "Ben recommended your shop " as a way to start the ball rolling (I can't tell from your log-in if you are Ben)....
I remember being told that they would put on outside parts, so the "ix-nay on the arts-pay" was disappointing... maybe it's the sort of thing where if they know you and have worked with you for awhile, they'll do it , but if they don't know you it may seem like more of a hassle or potential liability for them.
The guy I talked to said $150 total for the motor mounts, even though I had the parts. Compared to alamo's price of $50 to put 'em on, pretty big difference.
Who knows, maybe I sound naive on the phone & they wanted to see if I would go for it, I don't know.
On the other hand, maybe they just like you better. :-)
Thanks!!
Susan.
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I was actually recommending them to you seriously. My real name is in fact Ben. Notice that Ben backwards is Neb, thus my username. Neb is what a lot of my friends call me. I'm sorry you didn't have better luck at Eastside. I don't remember if you said the cheaper places were volvo shops or not, but non-volvo shops are generally cheaper for routines stuff. If you have a volvo quirk issue, you're usually better off going to someone who knows the cars. Maybe mentioning my name was a bad idea! I hope not though. There's a story I like to tell people when I recommend them to Swedish Motors and it goes like this... I had an 82 240 with about 250k on it. It died on the side of the highway one day with some sort of ignition problem. I don't remember exactly what it was. Anyway, I had it towed to swedish motors. They said it needed a part that was about $100, but cost about another $350 to put in because it's really hard to get to. I decided it was a good time to get a tuneup also. When I got the car back, the bill was about $600 including the tuneup and a few other small things. The next day the car died and left me stranded again. Needless to say I was a bit angry. I had it towed back to swedish motors. They fixed it for real this time, but didn't charge me any more money. Chris the service manager said he would have to talk to the owner about what to do about the other work I already paid for that didn't fix my problem. In my mind, given the mileage/condition/age of the car, I thought it would be fair to get refunded the $350 labor but pay for the $100 part, assuming I would have needed the it sometime anyway. I stopped by the next day and they totally refunded my money, even for the tuneup and other items. I was pretty impressed. I'm sorry you didn't get the same treatment.
Good luck.
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Hi Ben,
Yup, the other shop - Alamo Automotive - is a volvo-only shop too.....
I still appreciate the recommendation, even though it didn't pan out. The way I see it, I had to call a few shops to get prices, and I didn't have any shops in mind, so your info was still valuable as it widened the pool of choices.
I will probably call them again to see if I can get a good price on some work too. Ya never know, maybe next time they'll give me a great quote. ;)
Thanks again!
Susan.
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Hi Susan:
Alamo Automotive sounds pretty resonable. I would highly recommend my mechanic in Medford - about 4 1/2 hours south of P-town (Lindorf's Import Service) but probably not worth the drive for this work.
Please let me know after the fact how the service went. I am in Portland twice a month with my '90 Volvo 245 (246,xxx miles) and should probably have a mechanic I can go to up there if the need ever arises.
Happy Bricking!
Ed
'90 245 with 246,XXX miles
edc@cic-llc.com
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Hi Ed,
I'll be glad to let you know how it goes... I will be having the work done somewhere between the 7th and 20th of February (depending on how fast the cash trickles in) and I will post the results as soon as I'm done.
Happy Bricking to you too!
Susan.
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