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87 turbo. Looking for ideas here. a few weeks ago, it wouldn't idle at all. I unclipped the AMM while running and it seemed to go into limp home mode and would idle. I shut off the car, reattached the AMM and it would idle again This has the 007 AMM.
So I cleaned the AMM with the CRC mass airflow sensor cleaner. and have been driving around a bit. I checked the throttle position switch and it clicks on and off whenever the linkage is moved. Car seems to idle fine but whenever I lift off the throttle after accelerating or coasting, it dies. If I lift very slowly, it will not die. Restarts every time, no problem.
Any ideas what to check? My local Volvo wrench told me the idle air motor either works or it doesn't so I haven't fooled with that at all. I have checked pretty thoroughly for vacuum leaks too.
Thanks!
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I just wanted to update in case it might help anyone in the future.
I accessed the top of the in tank pump, hooked a piece of hose onto the outlet, fired up the car and got a nice stream of fuel. I took the whole sending unit and pump out anyway. I found the clamp on the hose between the down tube and the pump just a little bit loose. Since I was in there, I added a second stainless clamp a little further down and that tightened it up. Grounds all looked good so back in it went.
The other thing I did was to remove the fuel pump relay and re flow all the solder joints. None of them looked especially cracked but I did notice the thing seemed to be getting awfully hot while driving.
Last tank I ran the car down pretty near empty and no signs of the idle problem at all. It's been almost 300 miles now and the symptoms have disappeared. I don't know what fixed it, maybe the FPR. Within the next couple weeks, the car goes to a 16 year old girl. I'll miss it but it will have a good home. Thanks for the help!
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Hopefully last post in this thread. after a couple weeks, the refusing to idle problem returned. Additionally, I was beginning to get fail to starts. The fail to starts really stumped me. Replaced fuel pump relay and fuel pump to no avail. finally one day it wouldn't start and I unhooked the IAC and it fired right up.
So the first time I cleaned the IAC, I just did the sloshing of carb cleaner thing through the ports. It kinda worked for a while. This time I disassembled it by bending the tabs open and actually cleaned the slip rings where the little contact brushes ride. The procedure is in the FAQ. Reassembled and voila, idles perfectly again and has started every time for two days.
I was going to sell this car but now I'm thinking of keeping it, I just saw post on FB from a guy who has a 88 turbo with over 400K on it!
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The disconnecting the AMM may be a clue. It may be failing, yet not failed.
The 700-series air filter box has the same issue as the 240 air filter box with the preheater flap valve control, yes? (I can't recall, been a long time I looked at one.) Meaning the springy-themostat that controls the air flap valve gets stuck to hot air inlet only.
Else, check the air intake (turbo) piping from the air filter box to the turbo, to the intercooler, and from the intercooler to the air intake. We don't know condition or service history or maintenance of your Volvo Turbo 700-series.
You do run synthetic oil in your 1987 Turbo 700-series, yes?
Other than those with direct experience with your 700-series turbo with fuel injection / ignition control, if not already, please review relevant articles in the 700-900-90 series FAQ.
https://www.brickboard.com/FAQ/700-900/EngineTurbo.htm
Tips for finding air intake leaks, specifically.
You may also have fault with the idle control system. See the FAQ and search for articles on turbo charged 700-series before 1988 or so.
Else, you may want to use the search tool to find threads here that treat the same symptoms as yours such as releases the accelerator pedal causes the engine to quit.
Else, take a look at turbobricks.com for like symptoms and their resolution.
I've not ever owned a turbo Volvo. Only repaired them. That was sometime ago.
Hope that helps.
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Radio KAOS, 89.3 Olympia, WA
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Thank you!
I read your message then went to the FAQ. I had already cleaned the throttle body, so I decided to try cleaning the IAC valve. Just squirted some MAF cleaner in there and swooshed it around. That seems to have solved it, I drove about 50 miles yesterday and the problem seems to have gone away. Cheers!
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Hi Volvo Farmer,
Oooph, oh, thank the Volvo 700-900 series FAQ folks. They make and curate all that info in there.
Though glad to help!
The FAQ makes good reading when seeking the direct experience of other 700-900 (and sometimes rear wheel drive 90) series owner operators. The info transcends that which you may find in the available aftermarket services guides for your 1987 700-series Turbo. Helped me and others with the 240 stuff.
If not already, check out:
http://www.k-jet.org/documents/greenbooks/700-series/
http://www.volvowiringdiagrams.com/?dir=
And the innumerable topical threads you already know about.
Also, read up on the air filter preheater control flap thermostat in or on your air filter box. You may know of this already. While researching another thread, your 1987 740 Turbo uses a Whaler thermostat to control air temps that engine inhales. This thermostat is known to fail, though if it failed to the cold or warm side on 700-series, well, I forget right now. (Failed to preheat hot air inlet on 240s, frying the AMM). I'm unsure CO-state emissions, yet I read on the CO-DOT website there is no visual inspection of emissions controls. You need only pass the emissions gas analyzer at the tail pipe or drive by a CO-DOT test van on a free way on or off ramp. At any rate, to not fry your AMM in your beloved 1987 Volvo 740 Turbo, if the thermostat fails to the hot air only position, replace the valve every so often, or, as emissions inspect allow, remove the flap valve assembly in or on the air filter box, upstream of the air filter. They do fail, and the newer parts may not be as reliable.
You can buy a replacement thermostat so your air filter flapper valve works.
Volvo OEM part number (PN) 1266826. Wahler (PN) 70411.
You can purchase replacement (prices without shipping - local parts store may be an option):
Tasca Volvo in Cranston, Rhode Island for 47$ (May or may not be made by Wahler, no image):
http://www.tascaparts.com/?p=catalog&mode=search&search_in=all&search_str=Volvo%201266826
FCP Euro in Groton, CT for 10$:
https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/volvo-engine-air-box-thermostat-1266826
iPd USA in Portland, OR for 13$
https://www.ipdusa.com/products/5451/103083-airbox-thermostat-valve
I removed the preheater hose and removed the flap valve assembly on my 1992 240 GL so air is drawn in through both open air inlet ports. On a Turbo, that may mean a bit more sprightly throttle (we hope).
Must be so nice being up nearly 7000 feet where you are in mighty CO-state. I'll bet you folks have excellent tap water. The snowy season must so lovely! (Trying for jobs in NW CO like Ft Collins, though would like to go a little west of the front range on the winward side of a mountain range so you get some rain and snow. Well, we'll see. The 240 seems to like the high elevations! Tho I don't go anywhere too fast.)
Must be so nice having that M46 in there behind the Turbo. Nice you swapped that in from the AW-7x auto. (The M47s in these later, non-turbo 240s are sort of frail things. Though I motor gently, usually. To the consternation of the somewhat aggressive St. Louis, Misery motorists. Not as bad ten years on, tho.)
Glad that worked out!
Happy Sunday.
MacDuff.
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No emmissions here, none. The car hasn't had a hose between the airbox and manifiold since I've owned it, and that has been eight years.
Looks like the problem returned today after being fine for the last 150 miles and 3 days. I have a buddy that might let me borrow a spare 007 AMM for a diagnostic tool. Whatever this problem I have is, it seems to be intermittent, which makes it more challenging. I kinda sold the car to a friend and would like to sort this issue before turning it over to her.
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I'll have to think about it.
Have you researched this behavior here and on turbobricks.com? Idling problems, or restoring idle after a run, may be similar in cause to your issue.
The turbo adds an extra system, or control layer, to consider. And also how you are driving it, than remove your foot from the accelerator pedal, to consider possible causes.
Are you driving gently or spiritedly and lift your foot and the engine dies in gear? Or you take it out of gear, remove your foot from the accelerator pedal, as if you are coming to a stop light or stop sign. And the engine quite running.
Does it have any problem idling either cold or warm? Or both?
Is this behavior more pronounced when cold or at running temperature?
It is nearly 30 years, so, you can have electrical gremlins (corrosion) at location along the engine control wire harness at wire harness connectors and grounds. It could be a matter of merely disconnecting and reconnecting electrical connectors to allow the bonded connection to re-seat with a better contact. Like the large connectors on the engine control units. The fuel control LH-Jetronic 2.2 box to the right of the passenger knee and in front of the door under the kick panel which is a bother to remove on 700-900 series controls the idle system. Though I'd check the IAC for continuity first. Disconnect the battery and let a few minutes pass before disconnecting electrics in the engine control system. (I though for awhile it was 30-minutes. Art corrected me. Or maybe that was the air bag?)
You have LH-2.2 (?) and some form of the EZK ignition with the in-distributor Hall-Effect sensor. I'm weak with repsect to 1980s Volvo models and their systems. I go from 75-79 and than 1989+. Though I'd worked on that 80s period brakes and exhaust and suspension and mounts. I rarely ever encountered the Diesel Volvos from that era.
1. I'd say at the start some kind of vacuum leak. Yet without a history of replaced parts and service and mileage. I'm unsure. There is the obvious piping of the intake, and that includes all space and seals and unions up to and including the throttle body gasket and the air intake port gasket. The O-ring injector seals also fail in time.
2. You cleaned the Idle Air Control solenoid valve (IAC). With a multimeter, you can check the connector contacts for resistance when off and cool. I can't remember, I think resistance is 10-12 Ohms? Test between the center pin and you should have continuity with the two outer pins. 10-12 ohms? I'm reading on a turboricks article. The does not sound right. Since you cleaned it and if the IAC connector contacts check out, I guess that would not be the cause.
Do you use synthetic or mineral engine oil?
3. The other cause could be a failing throttle position switch (TPS), in that the switch, when you take your foot off of the accelerator, does not (oh, I'd have to look it up again) make (close) the contact so the idle control 'turns on'. With your multimeter, you can discern a poor contact or no contact (no continuity). The TPS can get gucked up with engine oil road grimey stuff and yet still be salvagable. They are robust yet not well sealed and after years may merely be dirty or require replacement.
4. Another cause can be a dirty throttle body with clogged orifices or carbonization build up inside that prevents the butterfly valve from closing, and in turn, interfering with the TPS action. Engine temp can have an effect.
Or a combination of this and other causes.
Have you pulled and checked spark plug gap? Do you have a some nickel or better anti-seize for the spark plug thread? You can check running condition whether just right, too rich, or too lean.
You have a very limited OBD fault check on the LH-2.2 EZK 1xx, yet you may have to check other sensors and devices with a multimeter. You need a test light that you can fabricate.
See: https://www.brickboard.com/FAQ/700-900/EngineOBDCodes.htm#Bosch22Codes
Also, read about Idle:
https://www.brickboard.com/FAQ/700-900/EnginePerformanceSymptoms.htm
Further flung could be ....
- Check and reset timing belt tension (replace every 50k, new timing belt tension every second tinning belt.)
- Check for damp fuel in the vacuum line between the fuel rail control pressure regulator (CPS) and the air intake port.
- Check the 02 sensor using the lowest DC volt range on your multimeter. The procedure is posted in the 700-900 FAQ.
While you may have removed the preheat hose, the engine control system (both injection and ignition) rely on proper working emission control sensor and devices to work well. These devices keep fuel emission low, fuel economy high (relatively in a Turbo), and in good tune.
Yet it is best to diagnose exhaustively to find the cause, or, in the instance of a nearly 30-year old Volvo, like the three I own. You do not want to begin throwing new parts at it needlessly without having identified the causes.
Some extra reading:
mentiosn the Turbo IAC may be not so reliable, and check the TOPS:
http://forums.turbobricks.com/showthread.php?t=14485
May indicate the voltage output driver from the LH-Jet ECU may fail (burnt part), though an extreme case. A different LH-Jet ECU than yous in an 89?
http://www.matthewsvolvosite.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=41968
Sorry to be so speculative.
Let me know when you have a tech writer job open in your area.
Questions?
Thanks,
B.
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Okay, I think I have it figured out. It started dying again at about 1/4 tank of gas. I drove it to pretty near empty and went to fill up. The car refused to start after I filled it up so I pushed it away from the pump into a parking spot.
Came back 2 hours later and the car started right up and the dying problem is gone again. I think I have a bad in tank fuel pump.
Thank you for the help but why do you keep asking me if I use synthetic oil? I do not put synthetic oil in a $800 car with 220K on the clock. Somehow, it has survived just fine all these years on conventional oil. What is the connection between conventional and synthetic oil and driveability issues? I don't understand.
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Hi Volvo Farmer,
Mineral (dino or conventional) oil use leads to more combustion by-products from the heated sump oil. As combustion by products leave the hot areas of the engine, like through the PCV (positive crankcase ventilation), the vapors condensate, causing, over time, deposits in the throttle body and other locales. The build-up can lend itself as a cause to poor running, idle, and such. I was only asking.
So, as long as you had this problem of the engine unable to idle, and halting, on throttle lift, or release the accelerator pedal, you've run through several tank fulls note the symptom forms consistently?
As you have Bosch fuel pumps, the in-tank pump can fail. Also, the section of flexible fuel line between the in-tank pump output and the outlet at the top of the fuel sending unit can deteriorate. The indication on 240 is 1/2 tank, consistently. Though I see the 740 in-tank fuel pump outlet sits much lower in the tank. The image from the eBay auction, above, shows the assembly with the shut off roll over valve.
You'll need a bung tool or brass tool to produce no spark as you remove the gland nut that retains the fuel sender unit. I'm unsure whether a near empty tank or full tank would be safer, yet be careful of the heavier than air fumes.
Correspondingly, as to electrical gremlins so aforementioned, and is a bane for the 700-900 models, specifically in your 1987 740 Turbo, is the under the center dash ashtray relay /fuse box assembly. The fuel pump relay seats there, and over time, even in dry climes, can form corrosion at bonded contacts, where the relay make contact with the spade terminals locked into the molded plastic tray or platform. If you remove the ashtray and look down on the top of the tray, and see deformation of the plastic, the assembly would require some service.
White fuel pump relay in your 740:
At Dave Barton's website:
http://www.davebarton.com/volvorelays.html
See specifically: Relay Locations - 1987 740/760 (PDF)
http://www.davebarton.com/pdf/relay_87_700.pdf
Another cause to your symptom perhaps worth looking into with your multimeter. The relay can be easily mended as described on Dave Barton's page and many articles threads with a soldering pencil.
Else, you may want to review:
https://www.brickboard.com/FAQ/700-900/EngineFuelinjection.htm
I can't do better than Art Benstein and John Sergeant's entries here.
If you surmise the in-tank fuel pump is the root cause, as attributed to low fuel level through several fuel tank empty and refill cycles, I hope your repair corrects the problem.
You can access the fuel pump relay to activate both pumps and listen for their operation. The exact procedure is lost on me. Please search the forum. As a means to resolve a faulty in-tank or main fuel pump. The main fuel pump may make a sound like bees buzzing in a glass jar is starved for fuel from the in-tank lift pump.
Else, if the problem persists for you and the buyer of the 1987 Volvo 740 Turbo, I'll let other sages respond to provide remediation suggestions.
Certainly a 1987 Volvo 740 Turbo is worth more than 800$!!! I've always wanted something like that. Yet no place to park it indoors and service it privately undercover.
I mean, I don't even have a garage.
Hope that helps. As Uncle Porkface always signs off: "Good luck, Chuck."
Thank you,
MacDuffy's Earl Grey Tea Taverna and Flax Seed House.
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