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brake line cross tee questions 120-130

posted by  hairy apple on  Thu Apr 16 17:58 CST 2015
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last visit: Sat Aug 9 14:47 CST 2014
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After I removed my master cylinder with some difficulty, I've decided to change the rusty brake lines. One line leaves the MC and goes to a cross t where two lines go to the front wheels and the last to the back. The cross t holds the brake light switch too.

There seems to be just one big phillips screw holding the cross t to the firewall. Is that correct? Is there a threaded nut fixed inside the fire wall or is the screw of the sheet metal type?

Are the fittings all double flare? Are brake line kits available anywhere?








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    brake line cross tee questions 120-130

    posted by  planetman on  Thu Apr 16 22:34 CST 2015
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    last visit: Fri Oct 24 09:29 CST 2014
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    All the brake lines should be DOUBLE flare except for the brake line end that goes into the brake calipers which are bubble flares.

    All the fitting threads are 3/8" x 24 including the bubble flare tube nuts.

    FYI, the female brake line tube nuts use a 12mm wrench and the adapter that screws into the end of the brake master cylinder is a 15mm,

    BTW I have the stock brake masters in stock,
    --
    Eric
    Hi Performance Automotive Service (formerly OVO or Old Volvos Only)
    Torrance, CA 90502
    hiperformanceautoservice.com or oldvolvosonly.com








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      brake line cross tee questions 120-130

      posted by  derek uk on  Fri Apr 17 03:47 CST 2015
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      last visit: Fri Oct 24 12:33 CST 2014
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      Save the old tube ferrules. They are threaded to the very end so give you a secure fix. Same thread available with a short plain end. These will only give about one and half threads fixing, not safe. The all threaded type not easy to find even in the UK, as they seem to be pretty well exclusive to older Volvos. Eric probably has them though. By recycling the existing nuts you can probably find someone local who can duplicate your old ones at a sensible cost. Use "Kunifer" cupro-nickel tubing, not copper. There may well be a reply saying I always use copper as it's easy to bend, but it work hardens and often cracks when doing the flares.








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    brake line cross tee questions 120-130

    posted by  Ron Kwas on  Thu Apr 16 19:58 CST 2015
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    last visit: Fri Oct 24 04:03 CST 2014
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    HA,

    Single big Phillips head bolt secures junction block to firewall...into a threaded nut captive in the firewall...so no need to worry about a nut...but there should be a wire with a ring terminal on that bolt...its the chassis connection for fan (we just recently figured that out on the forum)...clean this ring terminal and associated connections well and assure bolt is snug for good fan electrical supply and operation.

    ...from memory, I believe ends are single flares at junction block and double at wheel components, but inspect and match the replacements exactly before installing...ask for British threads when replacing lines individually.

    Good Hunting!








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      brake line cross tee questions 120-130

      posted by  volvorelix on  Thu Apr 16 21:07 CST 2015
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      last visit: Thu Oct 23 21:56 CST 2014
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      Aren't the fittings plain ol' 3/8x24?

      I've not seen single flares on the 122 brakes.

      Cameron
      Portland OR








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        brake line cross tee questions 120-130

        posted by  hairy apple on  Fri Apr 17 15:04 CST 2015
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        last visit: Sat Aug 9 14:47 CST 2014
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        I have never heard of single flares being used on brake lines either. Doule and bubble like the gum usually or maybe a banjo? Not sure about that.







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        brake line cross tee questions 120-130

        posted by  hairy apple on  Fri Apr 17 15:01 CST 2015
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        last visit: Sat Aug 9 14:47 CST 2014
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        Thanks for the responses. Eric please post cost and shipping for a MC to Connecticut 06896 or send an email to asiciliano@mac.com. I shopping for one now. And Ron, that wire is right where it ought to be and hopefully a big phillips bit in a small socket fixed to a ratchet with take it out. Why would they use a phillips headed screw? I'm always amazed by what I consider really poor choices like this, as far as I'm concerned. Other poor design choices, as pointed out to me just today by KG in Harwich, Ma., are armored cable-which I can agree with and rear brake adjusters-haven't had much trouble with those but I can see where you could.

        Ferrule at MC is 12mm, of course I had every line wrench size except 12 and the big fitting is 15mm but threads into a 3/8 x 24 hole. Bolts that hold MC to firewall are 5/16" x 18 x 7/8". Cylinder is 7/8".








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          brake line cross tee questions 120-130

          posted by  planetman on  Sat Apr 18 10:24 CST 2015
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          last visit: Fri Oct 24 09:29 CST 2014
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          I think you will find that you will have problems if you use a standard sized hex head 1/4" bolt instead of the 1/4" Phillips head machine screw to retain the brake distribution block.

          IIRC, the problem arises when you are tightening/loosening the brake light switch. The wrench/socket hits the edge of the head of the 1/4" bolt.

          $135.00 for a stock brake master cylinder and $10.00 for shipping and I have 1 in stock.
          --
          Eric
          Hi Performance Automotive Service (formerly OVO or Old Volvos Only)
          Torrance, CA 90502
          hiperformanceautoservice.com or oldvolvosonly.com








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          brake line cross tee questions 120-130

          posted by  derek uk on  Sat Apr 18 03:56 CST 2015
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          last visit: Fri Oct 24 12:33 CST 2014
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          Phillips and the even better Posidrive give secure and self centring of the screwdriver which is very useful when you're have to tackle it at a bit of an angle. Phillips have a pointed tip which can stop the driver seating effectively when the cross head gets worn. Posi-drive has a blunt end which overcomes this.
          Rear brake adjusters are steel moving parts in an alloy block. Not a good mix but no problem if kept well greased. The armoured cable is rarely a problem unless one of the PO's has B*gg*r*d it up!








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            bad choices? 120-130

            posted by  Ron Kwas on  Sat Apr 18 07:55 CST 2015
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            last visit: Fri Oct 24 04:03 CST 2014
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            Ditto to Dereks remarks...and I'll add...

            The self-centering feature of Phillips/Posi is nice in a production setting, when many fasteners are secured with air drivers, but otherwise, I don't see any special need for it to be Phillips/Posi...it could have just as easily been a hex-head fastener...

            As far as "bad choices" by Volvo...I wouldn't call them that...because let's put this in perspective...we're talking about issues after 50 years here...so I prefer to call them loooong-term weaknesses! Brake adjusters were greased when new and lasted a good long time...an the armored cable also lasted very well and was (and continues to be!) effective anti-theft measure...I understand some manner of anti-theft measure was even required by European auto insurances...and although only rudimentary, the armored cable does satisfy this requirement...

            Part of the fun? (charm anyway!) of vintage car ownership is figuring out and dealing with these "long-term weaknesses"...which in many cases are subtle indeed (i.e. corrosion of electrical terminals, dissimilar metal issues, cumulative key fatigue), but once understood and dealt with, the cars just keep on rolling and working for us...it's pretty satisfying...

            Cheers








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              bad choices? 120-130

              posted by  hairy apple on  Sat Apr 18 09:15 CST 2015
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              last visit: Sat Aug 9 14:47 CST 2014
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              I stand admonished and humbled as well.

              But I'll use a hex head to replace the phillips.

              As a building contractor and carpenter I'll say that I turned a lot of phillips screws. Square drives improved on these then we upgraded to torx type heads, the best yet as far as I'm concerned for production type screwing of wood, sheetrock etc. This is especially true with the very petit heads found on "trim" screws where #0 or #1philipps heads would often disappoint.







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