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1988 240 DL Running Rough/Stalling in the Cold? 200 1988

posted by  ahurst on  Thu Jan 8 13:10 CST 2015
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Hi, everyone! Long time lurker, first time poster. My brick is in trouble and I need guidance.

So this afternoon when driving to class, my '88 240 wagon ran rough and lumpy for the 15 meters from the driveway to the end of the street, where it sputtered completely to death in front of the stop sign. Gunning the engine desperately caused the gauges and warning lights to go wild and a couple hopeful sputters before draining the battery with a minute or so. Thankfully some helpful passers-by stopped to help me push it back into the driveway after a couple minutes.

I've had similar issues over the past week with the engine shaking and running lumpy for the 3-8 minutes it take to warm up, but it's never been bad enough to cause a stall before. This is the first week I've driven it in the full Canadian cold as well (-12º C/10º F outside right now), so I'm guessing the two are linked since I've had no trouble with the engine in warmer weather.

Some possible causes I've found from some Googling are:

• An old and brittle intake manifold gasket, hardening more in the cold and causing the engine to run lean
• A vacuum leak somewhere causing the engine to run lean
• A faulty/dead coolant temp sensor (my engine temperature gauge has always been very slow to go from zero to about halfway ever since I got the car, does that make this a likely culprit?)
• IAC, fuel pumps, and a whack of other things that seem less likely than the above.

Which of those seems most likely, and how should I go about diagnosing the issue? Unfortunately my car is the model year before OBD was added, so I'll have to do it manually.

Any help is greatly appreciated, I hate to see my brick in such poor health.

Thanks in advance!








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    1988 240 DL Running Rough/Stalling in the Cold? 200 1988

    posted by  Rene on  Thu Jan 8 23:17 CST 2015
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    last visit: Thu Oct 23 19:43 CST 2014
    [RELATED]

    Your engine should be warming up quicker(thermostat)This is important to prevent sludge.Extremely so in cold weather
    Fuel filter?Throw in fuel deicer just in case(this is rarelly required if you keep tank full ALWAYS
    ,There is often wear on bellows between air mass meter and throtle bodyif it touches body,causing large air leak.
    Fill gas tank. If this improves running , you have leak at rubber hose from prepump in tank.
    You could have condensation(now ice)in distributor cap ,also check dist cap
    carefully for arcing or crack

    Thath would be my primary list. Good luck

    --
    Rene








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      1988 240 DL Running Rough/Stalling in the Cold? 200 1988

      posted by  joekidd on  Fri Jan 9 07:20 CST 2015
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      last visit: Fri Oct 24 10:54 CST 2014
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      If you smell fuel in FPR line its leaking and should be replaced as it will flood your engine and cause it to run rough until it stalls. If your battery is 7 yrs old regardless of where it spent it days its most likely finished and that too should be replaced. As far as the heat goes where does the temp needle sit on the guage? If it takes too long to move then most likely a new T-stat is in order like other posters suggest.








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    1988 240 DL Running Rough/Stalling in the Cold? 200 1988

    posted by  machine man on  Thu Jan 8 18:16 CST 2015
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    last visit: Wed Oct 22 15:40 CST 2014
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    Hi there
    I think you are looking for more of an electrical problem related to the battery going dead.
    Batteries to not go dead that fast unless they were very low to begin with.

    It would be best to see if the battery will recharge and hold it. Check the voltage of the system after charging and the car running. You need above 13.5 to 14.2 to be normal.

    Low voltage in the system causes the dash lights to flash as its conking out. Low voltage Plays big tricks with computer operation.
    It's like having a reset button wired up to your home computer with the switch rolling about loosely in the bottom of a box car with the train moving. Random things can happen!

    You were very lucky to have only gotten that far!

    You ask what happened from when it's warm....ask about what happens to batteries in the cold.
    As far as the temperature gauge you might have a thermostat that is stuck open or stays partially open all the time to create slowness.

    The other coolant sensor, in the very back, is for the ECU.

    Does the heater warm up fairly fast no matter if it's cold. It will be a little slower in winter of course, by maybe, a mile or so longer, if that.

    Phil








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      1988 240 DL Running Rough/Stalling in the Cold? 200 1988

      posted by  ahurst on  Thu Jan 8 20:44 CST 2015
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      Hi, thanks for the response!

      It's entirely possible that the battery is in bad shape as it is 7 years old, although it's lived 6 of those in warm climates and before now seemed to be in decent shape. And yes, the heater in my 240 usually takes a good 5-10 minutes to start blowing hot air if I haven't used it earlier in the day, I've been wondering what was wrong with it since the Volvo heaters are supposed to be legendary for their power. Does that also suggest the battery is on its way out?







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        1988 240 DL Running Rough/Stalling in the Cold? 200 1988

        posted by  machine man on  Fri Jan 9 00:28 CST 2015
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        last visit: Wed Oct 22 15:40 CST 2014
        [RELATED]

        To answer if the thermostat is causing battery failure... is ... just not possible.

        They are Two separate systems.

        You need to drain off enough coolant that you cannot feel or hear any sloshy sounds coming the insides of the upper hose.
        There is a draining nipple fitting on the right side of the engine block down under and behind the exhaust manifold.
        Loosen the outer hex flats about three turns and let it weep out through a long clear vinyl hose to a bucket. It will take a couple quarts to lower the level below the hose connection.

        Replace it with a 92 degree Celsius, Wahler brand brass thermostat. Their the best in my opinion for repetitive accuracy and longevity. They come as Original Equipment Manfacture (OEM) in all years of production.
        The little jiggle vent goes on the upward side of the opening so any excessive air trapped in the head or system will pass, float or rise towards the highest part of the system, which is the plastic reservoir.

        FYI, you want air out of the system. Where ever there is air bubble against a cylinders water jacket, there is less heat transfer. Same goes for inside a heater core or a radiator tubes. Their both radiators. If you ever start overheating in the future, turn on your heater and fan! Its like adding on another half a radiator.

        Get the battery up to snuff and report back when it cranks! You may have more treats lurking in there yet.

        Phil








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    1988 240 DL Running Rough/Stalling in the Cold? 200 1988

    posted by  joekidd on  Thu Jan 8 13:45 CST 2015
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    last visit: Fri Oct 24 10:54 CST 2014
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    You make no mention of the miles on the clock or any maintenance or repairs done recently. Pull the vaccum line on the FPR and smell for raw fuel. How is your fuel pump relay? Air filter? Throttle body ever been cleaned? 25 amp fuse/ holder condition? Yeah all those possible vaccum leaks will cause rough and high idling.You can test each fuel pump with car off. How much gas is in the tank when it happened? Intake pre-pump pickup hose can cause problems when the tank is low. Fuel filter? Bad gas? With the car off pull the AMM connector and see if the car will start for you.








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      1988 240 DL Running Rough/Stalling in the Cold? 200 1988

      posted by  ahurst on  Thu Jan 8 15:27 CST 2015
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      Thanks for the reply!

      The vacuum line on the fuel pressure regulator does smell like raw fuel. Fuel pump relay was replaced this summer with the OEM Volvo part after some intermittent stalling and starting issues (the only other time the car has died on me), the air filter was replaced in March of last year when I got the car, and the throttle body has been cleaned recently. The fuses in the fuse holder have all been replaced with high-quality ceramic fuses as well as contacts cleaned at the same time as the fuel pump relay was replaced.

      The car has 269,000 miles on it, the vast majority of which were from the previous owner who bought it new and drove it daily for 25 years. Sadly, as him and his wife were retiring and selling everything they owned (including the car, $800!) to join the Peace Corps they had already thrown away the maintenance and service records by the time I bought it, but that wasn't really a sticking point at the price. Regardless it seems to have been very well cared for. The distributor cap and rotor, MAF, flame trap, spark plugs and wires (and an oil change) were done as soon as I got the car.

      I think there was roughly a quarter tank of gas in it when it stalled, but I can't confirm as the battery is drained and the car won't turn over (my roommate's going to boost it later). Atlantic Canada gas isn't the highest quality so that might be a factor, but I've never experienced anything like this before the winter set in and I always fill it with Premium at the pump.

      Sorry I excluded so much relevant information in the first post. Does this help narrow it down at all?







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