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95 945T. Tried 3 batteries. One was pretty dead, got it started with another, swapped the first back in, ran it, turned it off and restarted no problem, then ran fine. Went a couple miles and then no restart. Tried the 2 other batteries again. There is no 'click' when the key is turned, in park or neutral. All the dash lights come on correctly. Moving the lever as outlined in the FAQ has no result either.
Aside from the NSS, what other things to consider? Heavy rain here so will look at the starter connections in the am.
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"Heavy rain here so will look at the starter connections in the am. "
Which will, in all likelihood be where the trouble is.
Best approach there, when the rain quits and if you can catch the problem occurring again, is to have a jumper rigged for the "test socket" or under-hood starter switch, so one hand is free to check for voltage at the braid wire going into the starter brushes from the solenoid terminal. The pull-in coil in the solenoid (it actually has two) depends on getting a ground (or load) through the brushes, so if the brushes are short you'll likely hear more of a grunt than a click if you listen close. A test light or meter will prove it for you and save the work of swapping a starter if that's not it.
Are you familiar with the test socket on your 900?
--
Art Benstein near Baltimore
Be nice to your kids. They will choose your nursing home one day.
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Art, I am embarrassed to say that after all this time on the board I don't know how to use that socket. It's there and has sometimes made me think 'I should know that', but it never happened.
There are two sockets in the plug but one wire to it; what does one do to it to make the starter turn?
Edit; I cannot find anything anywhere on how to use that socket. I see references to using it, but not how.
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Here's a pic from 2004 by Javalion (Tom).
I'm ashamed to say the one on my '93 940 has a problem, but son's '92 works like it should.
--
Bruce Young, '93 940-NA (current), 240s (one V8), 140s, 122s, since '63.
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I know where and what it is, just not what to do with it exactly. On all the 7/9 cars I've had (I think, trying to recall the ones now gone) it's a blue D plug with a pink wire to it. So just run a wire to the batt + terminal, briefly?
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Yes, that's right. But keep in mind, this is just a substitute for having a helper turn the key. The test socket does not bypass the neutral safety switch, at least assuming it works the same as the 240. When it stops raining, give this a try. At least from under the hood you can hear better what is going on at the starter.
--
Art Benstein near Baltimore
Mistakes are the portals of discovery. -James Joyce
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Ah, so it does Not bypass NSS. Ok thx; am on the way.
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So I had left it with the good but dead battery on a charger. I got there, removed charger, was about to dive in when I thought I'd turn the key and see what happened.
It started right up.
Over, and over, and over again, 12 times at least. So I drove it, no problems.
Hmm. It did have some weirdo alarm system which I pulled the wires to the horn, and later my friend bypassed the NSS. THe thinking there was if it ever stalls on the highway there is no way to restart while in motion, which I thought was bizarre, so...
So what happened I actually do not know. Maybe not a good connection so low voltage to the key, which did not put sufficient voltage to the solenoid?
Oh, the NSS looked perfectly fine.
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I have a '93 940 T which does the same thing and it's been doing this off and on for over five years. Like you, I had an alarm system and had it removed because of this symptom but it didn't go away. It seems to do it more when the weather is warm and the car but it's done it when cold too. Anyway, I'm able to start it by simply turning the key over and over again until it starts. I think the longest period of doing this was a half an hour. Sometimes, if you turn the key and hold it, there's a delay before it engages the starter which might be important in solving this problem.
I've changed the starter ignition and starter but the "no starts" still happen from time to time. I take comfort in knowing that it will start eventually. :)
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Confession time.
Went to meet #4 daughter in a parking lot in town; '91 sedan won't crank. Same symptoms as yours: Open door, observe dome light, key to start position, dome light remains on but no sound from the starter. Wiggle the shifter. Nothing.
Measured voltage between the starter casting and both studs on solenoid - 11.7. Voltage at terminal 50 (wire from NSS) followed the key. Dug the snow brush out of the trunk (this was a very hot afternoon) and gave the starter a rap with the end of it, tried again, and she drove it home.
Dug out a pile of starter parts I'd been meaning to rebuild, went through the process of rebuilding one (brushes and bendix drive in this case) and set it on the shelf. Called up Daughter #4 and said "any time you're ready."
Two months pass. Grandson calls from college parking lot. Snowbrush trick doesn't cut it on his '90. Ah, I have a starter! Tow truck brings me the car, and we swap in my rebuild job. Later I rebuild that one (commutator) and write up the early failure of a genuine Bosch rebuild. Many more months pass with no starter complaints. Daughter's starter never got changed. Knock wood on metal.
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Art Benstein near Baltimore
Always keep your words soft and sweet, just in case you have to eat them.
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Art
Do you have a write up about repairing starters? I have a couple I should look at that were replaced from my cars.
Thanks
Dan
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Hi Dan,
I have a short one about getting the thing out of the car, but not anything as yet about home DIY "remanufacturing" them. Have some pics; sounds like an opportunity.
Main help I can offer is to identify the most recent source of my replacement parts for alternators and starters: http://aspwholesale.com/
:)
--
Art Benstein near Baltimore
"Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy." - Benjamin Franklin
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Dear Art Benstein,
Hope you're well. Have you ever dealt with Barsanco, Inc.; 26674 Liberal;
Centerline, MI 48015; Tel: 1-800-421-3374; Fax: 1-586-755-1618; e-mail info@barsanco.com. ?
Barsanco seems to have a pretty good range of repair parts. For example, see: http://www.barsanco.com/part/211-235.html for a rectifier, for a 100 Amp, Nippon-Denso alternator.
Hope this helps.
Yours faithfully,
Spook
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Thanks Art. I forgot to mention that the initial instance before it quit, when it just didn't start at all after several weeks of sitting til another 'good' battery was used to start it, the starter did receive several really good whacks with no result.
So is my idea of a switch problem maybe possible? Unfortunately I did not have presence of mind to test the voltage at the starter.
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Jerryc - Have you had any more starting problems? I just had mine do the same thing again and I still don't have a clue as to why it's doing this. I tried bump starting but nothing happened. I really don't know how to measure the volts at the solenoid described by Art... maybe he can explain it so I know how to do this.
I have not cleaned all the grounds, I just haven't had the time to do it. Today, when it didn't start, I can hear more of a clunk than a click. I think after repeated tries to start I also heard a click and a clunk.
After trying to test and bump start I went to start and it turned over for me. It takes a while sometimes but it always starts. I wonder if I should try a new starter. I had a new starter in but these symptoms showed up so I bought a remanufactured starter from a junk yard and the same thing is happening. BTW, the top bolt of the starter can be loosened from the engine compartment. You just have to put the box end wrench on backwards, so it's angled out. If you need more leverage add another box end to the open end. Just be careful not to tear wires or hoses loose when loosening the bolt.
GothM
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