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Fine . Rough running /stalling after 1/4 mile . Fine 200

posted by  someone claiming to be TJ Traver on  Sun Jul 14 08:54 CST 2013 [RELATED]

Has anyone encountered this problem ? Looking for ideas ...
1993 Volvo 240 , which 99.9% of the time runs flawlessly .
But sometimes after sitting on damp / humid days ... after starting just fine , after 1/4 mile when I come to my first stop and start to accelerate , it stumbles badly , to the point of stalling . It restarts hard and runs raggy , but if I put it into low gear and nurse it from the start up to road speed , it clears up then runs 100% again , with no further issues.

It does not log error messages . I've replaced the cap / wires / plugs / coil but the problem persists.

It seems to occur at the cold --> warm transition . Is there a thermal switch that may be going wonky ? Or what else ?

Appreciate any ideas or diagnostic questions .

Thanks, Todd








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    Fine . Rough running /stalling after 1/4 mile . Fine 200

    posted by  sparro on  Thu Jul 18 23:32 CST 2013
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    last visit: Mon Oct 13 15:59 CST 2014
    [RELATED]

    I had similar situation like that on my 91 240. My car ran fine mostly. Once in a rare while it does when it comes to a stop. I tried everything but the problem was there. Finally I went to the junk yard and picked the AMM (Air Mass Meter) for about $40. I replaced it.

    Since then, magically, the car would never stall.








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      Fine . Rough running /stalling after 1/4 mile . Fine 200

      posted by  someone claiming to be Todd on  Fri Jul 19 11:44 CST 2013 [RELATED]

      I have a spare known good AMM , and will try that phase 2 .
      I've had AMMs fail and this doesn't seem like that .
      They are were either good or they failed solid once they heat up.

      This problem is transient . It will occur ( or not ) within 1/4 mile the first time I come to a stop. And then has never (thankfully ) given me any problems beyond that point and single failure. The car will start fine and idle though a bit roughly, but as soon as I try to accelerate will seems to run on 1 of 4 cylinders and / or stall . Sometimes stall multiple times . But once I coax the car to go , it then runs PERFECTLY the rest of the day. This issue is more than an annoyance as I live in NY and stalling multiple times in an intersection is NOT a good way to start your day ! ( though does provide more pickmeup than a double shot of espresso , I can tell you that ! )

      So , I will first install new engine temp sensor that cost $10. This was listed as possible "no start" or "intermittent" culprit ( esp since most of the time my temp gauge doesn't work , then it jumps up, then dies again . I think it's the temp compensation board in the temp gauge but .... ). The engine temp sensor is supposed provide ECU reading of 0-300 Ohms , but apparently they can fail open while in transition , which freaks out the Bosch FI . I will next try cleaning the fuses . Then will then try the AMM. Then punt .

      Will let you know what I find . It may take a few weeks of hit or miss. Stay tuned .








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        Fine . Rough running /stalling after 1/4 mile . Fine 200

        posted by  Paulii on  Fri Jul 19 19:29 CST 2013
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        last visit: Fri Jun 6 03:04 CST 2014
        [RELATED]

        I have had several of the newer 240's have the same problem with a crank sensor going bad as well as the maf. meter. Something about the transition from cold to hot. My 89 should hit the 800,000 mark by the end of next month and at one point I had installed 3 crank sensors all within a month. Bap Geon now sells only the buroucord brand crank sensors. No more of the Chinese crap. Good luck and I hope you find the problem soon. Pauli








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          Fine . Rough running /stalling after 1/4 mile . Fine 200

          posted by  someone claiming to be TJ Traver on  Mon Jul 22 10:41 CST 2013 [RELATED]

          I agree and will replace the crank sensor . It does now seem like that could be the culprit. I didn't do that right off as mine is only 2 or 3 year old Bougicord( which I replaced it as PM to avoid just this sort of problem ... ). But this morning for the first time ever the car was hard to start , cranked , coughed and stalled as though it was off time , then started and ran rough for a few seconds , then cleared up and ran fine .

          I will let the group know what I ultimately find to be the problem .

          800,000 mi ? Wow big congrats !!
          In that amount of miles you must've pretty much seen it all .
          Mine's just a pup with 185k . My prior two 240s over the past 25 years I ran to about 300k which though still running fine , the bodies started to rust off from our NE salt .










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            Fine . Rough running /stalling after 1/4 mile . Fine ( and the answer is ... ) 200

            posted by  todd traver on  Fri Jul 26 09:21 CST 2013
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            last visit: Fri Jul 26 09:06 CST 2013
            [RELATED]

            After some sleuthing so far it appears to have been the AMM.
            ( Cigar goes to person who recommended checking that )

            Symptoms :

            - After problem as defined in the subject line ....

            - Last time I'd started the car a couple of days ago , it started very hard , ran rough, stalled .
            ( So I left it parked there and ordered temp and crank sensor )

            - Started the car this morning , started hard, ran rough, stalled , but ran.

            - Shut off the car . Unplugged AMM and restarted it . Started right up and ran alright . Swapped in known good AMM and it started , runs and drives fine .


            Side Note(s) :

            I then installed the new BOSCH temp sensor ( as PM ), because I had it and they can / do cause flaky problems on BMW motorcycles with very similar BOSCH FI system .

            I'm keeping the new crank sensor in the trunk for the time being.

            Immensely enjoyed throwing the failed AMM as far as I could !!








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        Fine . Rough running /stalling after 1/4 mile . Fine 200

        posted by  sparro on  Fri Jul 19 12:02 CST 2013
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        last visit: Mon Oct 13 15:59 CST 2014
        [RELATED]

        I read your original posting of symptoms again. It seems identical to mine almost. I had this stalling issues a few times a year. Then later perhaps once or twice a month. Nothing seemed to work.

        Then I changed AMM only because it was easy to do so. I was merely suspecting that my AMM may not be in good shape if my thermometer in the air box was not working properly. I replaced the air box thermometer as well.

        My problem has gone away since then. (about a year).

        Good luck!








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    Fine . Rough running /stalling after 1/4 mile . Fine 200

    posted by  HillBilly on  Sun Jul 14 14:22 CST 2013
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    last visit: Thu Oct 16 08:26 CST 2014
    [RELATED]

    Could be as simple as a corroded fuse or fuse holder.

    Remove and clean the ends of fuse #4 and it's holder.
    This fuse is located in the fuse panel beside the driver's left knee.

    Also, inspect the fuse under the hood that is mounted on the left fender well.
    Follow the smaller red wire from the battery positive terminal to the fender well. The fuse protects this wire (and circuit).

    Intermittent stall and rough running can be caused by a faulty fuse connection.

    It's simple and worth a look.

    Hope this helps
    steve








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    Fine . Rough running /stalling after 1/4 mile . Fine 200

    posted by  chup on  Sun Jul 14 11:59 CST 2013
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    last visit: Tue Sep 9 14:02 CST 2014
    [RELATED]

    I would check everywhere for vacuum leaks, esp the intake manifold gasket. Easy enough: while it's sitting there at idle spray something like WD40 anywhere air could get in on the intake side. If it smooths out and/or changes when you hit a certain spot then you found a leak.
    Or, you could try this:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zMok2y05jNE







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