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Call me paranoid, but with all the recent posts on fires and carbeques in late-model 240s, I'm starting to think that it's a wise idea to keep an extinguisher in the car somewhere in case of possible similar experiences.
However, I've been told that typical household extinguishers use dry chemical agents (ammonium phosphate, potassium bicarbonate and the likes) that are very corrosive to most things under the hood, or they use CO2 which is (supposedly) more dangerous in confined areas.
Of course, huge flames can be pretty bad for parts and humans too... :-)
Anyway, if a small fire like the ones being described occurred, I'd want to try to save the surrounding parts from corrosion as well as incineration!
I saw a while ago that IPD sold a fire extinguisher with a non-corrosive extinguishing agent, but like most of their products, it was fairly expensive. Are there cheaper compact alternatives for automotive use that are available in local stores? What brands and/or types of extinguishers do people on this forum typically keep handy?
Cheers all!
--
Zach in Vista, CA
1992 245 DL, B230F, LH2.4, M47
1970 145 S, B20B, SU HS6 x2, M41
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Spend the extra money and order a Halon extinguisher from a dealer. It will not be cheap like 4 times the price of dry chemical. But use a dry chemical one time and you`ll almost consider letting it burn up next time instead of using one again. They are the an abysmal EPA requirement that makes a mess like you can`t believe! Think of dumping a 20 pond bag of flour in your engine compartment.
http://www.jaylenosgarage.com/collections/skinned-knuckles/skinned-knuckles-all-about-fire-extinguishers/index.shtml
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Having spent 38 years in the fire service, I recommend nothing less than what we call a 10 pounder.
A powder extinguisher containing around 8-1/2 pounds of agent - 2A 10BC minimum - AND some water! This extinguisher will be about 15" tall and 4" in diameter. Unless the top is made of metal, it cannot be serviced. The green band on the pressure gauge represents pressure from freezing to about 135 degrees - the white stripe, room temperature.
Small extinguishers can have a discharge time of as little as 14 seconds - many people cannot even figure out where the agent is going in 14 seconds.
Obviously, if the pressure is low, it has leaked out, If the pressure is high, that may be a sign that there is a reaction going on - and the bottle may explode.
If you grab the extinguisher and there is no pressure - spin the top off and sprinkle the powder on the fire. Can't spin the top off? Stuff it under a tire and spin the bottle. You will be stronger than you usually are. I have seen a young lady pull a section out of a wall when she forgot to open the bracket on a small extinguisher.
You cannot use a little bit of powder and save the rest for another fire. Powder gets in the valve seat and the pressure that is left will be gone in a few days.
Powder and gas agents merely interrupt flame production. CO2 displaces oxygen (air).
The classic ingredients of a fire are fuel, oxygen, and heat, scientists added chain reactions to the formula when they tried to explain how powdered chemicals work as they do not remove any of the three classic ingredients.
Thank goodness that your old car is made of metal - plastic inner fenders and heater modules are murder to extinguish.
I have exhausted 20 pounders on car fires and not been able to achieve complete success,
You really need some water to cool the area so that it will not re-ignite.
Carry a gallon of water in your trunk to cool things off after you knock a fire down with your 10 pounder.
--
'96 855R,'64 PV544 driver, '67 P1800 basket case, '95 855, '95 854, the first three are mine, heh, heh, 485,000 miles put on 9 bricks
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Thanks a bunch for your advice and experience. I will keep an eye out for those labels when shopping around. :-)
--
Zach in Vista, CA
1992 245 DL, B230F, LH2.4, M47
1970 145 S, B20B, SU HS6 x2, M41
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I carry a B C type. Wallyworld under $20
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Post Back. That's whats makes this forum work.
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Sounds like a good price, as expected from the Wal. I'll probably stop by there this weekend and check out the selection.
Thanks!
--
Zach in Vista, CA
1992 245 DL, B230F, LH2.4, M47
1970 145 S, B20B, SU HS6 x2, M41
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Sweet Walmart trip this weekend? Can we hit it up at 12am?
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I'm down. What better idea than making a Walmart trip after watching Prometheus tomorrow evening?
I feel a sunburn developing on my neck...
--
Zach in Vista, CA
1992 245 DL, B230F, LH2.4, M47
1970 145 S, B20B, SU HS6 x2, M41
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I also like to keep a 10 mm wrench in the glove box to be able to disconnect battery quickly.
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Since I do not drive my 544 that often, I have a disconnect switch on the battery.
--
'96 855R,'64 PV544 driver, '67 P1800 basket case, '95 855, '95 854, the first three are mine, heh, heh, 485,000 miles put on 9 bricks
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posted by
someone claiming to be RR
on
Tue Jun 5 06:29 CST 2012 [ RELATED]
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Halon is no longer used, FM200 has replaced it. They are pretty expensive extinguishers and I would doubt thier capability putting out a fire under a hood outside. It works by removing the oxygen in the air, if its windy at all, its not going to function well. Co2, Halotron etc work the same way. These gas systems are usually used for enclosed computer/electrical rooms/equipment.
AFFF (foam) would probably be a good alternative, you can get foam good for Class B fires (flamable liquids) and after the fire is out it should clean up easily with water. Down side is they are about $200 for 2.5gal extinguisher. Make sure you get foam rated for Class B!
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I thought that the Halons and their replacements work both by replacing oxygen as well as chemically by releasing hydrogen that act as free radical inhibitors that stop combustion. They generally work at much lower concentrations for these reasons compared to CO2 and the like. They generally spray a liquid (no worry about wind) and the constituents of the liquid cool and deprive oxygen while some breakdown also occurs of the liquid to make a combustion quenching gas.
If I had to throw money down I would get a Halon style or foam extinguisher.
Mike
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Seems foam would be a good option except for the price! :-)
Thanks for the comments, all.
I took another look at IPD' site this evening, and apparently the extinguisher they offer is of the FireAde brand, is 16 ounces, is water-based (non-corrosive) and is $20 plus ship. Compared with 2.5 gallons (320 ounces) at $200 a pop, it's far more expensive per ounce, but it's still cheaper as a whole unit.
It supposedly works on combustible fires (Class A, B and D according to FA's website, although it seems questionable that such a base could effectively fight fuel fires???), and as long as there's a cutoff for electricity handy (like a breaker on the negative battery terminal), electrical fires should be manageable too.
I'm wondering if this is really a viable purchase, or if its firefighting potential is overstated as a sales tactic. I suppose it would be better than nothing, and although the price per ounce is very high, it seems like a feasible option if it really can fight a small car fire. Plus it's compact, which is nice.
On the off chance, has anybody ever had one of these, suffered the unfortunate circumstance of needing to use it, and can comment on its effectiveness?
--
Zach in Vista, CA
1992 Volvo 245 DL, B230F, 175k, M47 (Toaster)
1970 Volvo 145 S, B20B, 145k, M41 (Honey Badger)
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posted by
someone claiming to be RR
on
Wed Jun 6 09:31 CST 2012 [ RELATED]
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AFFF (foam) - Best suggestion for what your describing/wanting to achieve. High cost! $200.00
Purple K - dry agent. Next best solution. Its the only dry agent used for aircraft applications as it doesnt corrode aluminum. 2.5# ext. around $50.00
Any BC extinguisher is going to have sodium bicarbonate agent which is 'non-corrosive' but if it gets wet while on the aluminum it could cause mild corrosion. $20.00 5.0#
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Points well taken. Sixteen ounces did seem very minuscule compared with 2.5 gallons - hence my concern about its actual effectiveness.
Thanks for your feedback - it is much appreciated. :-) I'll shop around this weekend and see what I can find.
Cheers!
--
Zach in Vista, CA
1992 245 DL, B230F, LH2.4, M47
1970 145 S, B20B, SU HS6 x2, M41
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posted by
someone claiming to be RR
on
Wed Jun 6 08:26 CST 2012 [ RELATED]
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You could maybe put out a matchbook with that. Dont waste your money.
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Tough to find a Halon extinguisher as production of the stuff has been outlawed for some time. Recharging Halon systems must only use Halon recovered from another system, and even then there are strict rules. Apparently it is the worst ozone depleting chemical we have yet managed to invent.
There are EPA-approved substitutes, such as the "Halguard" extinguishers - maybe this is what you saw at IPD?
Not cheap; a small 10-inch long extinguisher is about $180 at car enthusiast shops. CO2 may be a preferable alternative.
--
Bob: son's XC70, dtr's '94-940, my 81GL, 83-DL, 89-745(V8) and 98-S90. Also 77-MGB and some old motorcycles.
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Do a search for Halon fire extinguishers. I believe that was what IPD was selling.
When I was in high school, my 544 caught on fire the second day I had it. Fortunately, it was in the driveway and I was able to get a fire extinguisher from the house. It was a powder type extinguisher and I didn't clean up the residue quickly enough. The chrome on the grill was ruined.
--
1966 122s, 1968 142s, 1969 144s, 1979 245dl, 1989 244gl
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