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A/C Clutch Investigation 200 1993

I've read a number of good posts regarding an a/c clutch that won't engage. Here is where I am at:

- a/c relay wasn't performing so I resoldered all of the joints and now it works.
- a/c system has enough pressure to close the pressure switch on the receiver dryer.
- 2.9 ohms between the fan clutch green wire and chassis ground. Is this good?
- 0.0 ohms between a/c compressor body and battery ground. This is good, right.
- I ran a ground jumper wire from the battery negative to the body of the a/c compressor. Still know clutch engagement.
- 13.46 volts at the green wire disconnect, disconnected (engine running).
- 12.30 volts at the green wire, disconnect connected (engine running). I would expect the voltage drop due to the resistance. Darned if I know the formula to predict the drop in voltage.
- 12.30 volts at the green wire just before it goes behind the clutch.

To completely eliminate the black ground wire chassis to a/c compressor I guess I have to remove it, test it and clean it.

At the top-center of the compressor the green wire disappears into the body and then comes back out. Is there a sensor or something in there? I get the same voltage on both sides of it.

Any other thoughts or a previous post I missed in my search?








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    A/C Clutch Investigation 200 1993

    I=E/R is ohms law. I is current, E Voltage, and R is resistance.

    I would take a wire from the black wire on the compressor clutch and touch it to the battery.

    Click and you have a clutch that kicked in.

    Regards,

    Paul








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      A/C Clutch Investigation 200 1993

      Paul,

      I saw your previous and excellent post (and thanks to all others that led Paul on his successful journey).

      The only black wire I have found is the one that is bolted at one end to the accessory mount (which is in turn connected to the block) and the other end bolted to the back of the compressor. Is there another black wire from there?








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        A/C Clutch Investigation 200 1993

        On the back of the compressor is a connector that you unsnap. That is the wire that goes directly to the compressor clutch. Well at least on the older AC's it is. Anyway, if you push a wire up (if the wire is too small here is a trick, strip the insulation further back and fold the wire over so the diameter is doubled). Insert the wire on the side of the connector (repeat in the connector first) that goes to the compressor and touch it to the plus battery terminal. The reason for doing the connector first is that do not want to go fishing for a connection with a hot wire in the meat hand. The hand wanders over to a ground and the sparks can go flying. If you are cautious and safety minded, use as switch and after you get the wires into place, flip it. You should be rewarded with a click and then see the clutch move just a bit. You can try this with the engine off, lowers the background noise and it’s a simple test. If you do get the click, then start the car and try it again. If you hear the clutch go click and the compressor start growling you have a place to start. No click and the clutch will still not move and most likely you have a compressor clutch gone bad or ground issue still.

        I have seen a lot of green up in those connectors and in fact have replaced all of Inga's with crimp connectors. I have an 86 and that wire was pretty much as we say down here "necked" as is insulation had fallen off. That along with the green gunk inside the connectors led me to do away with them.

        Good Luck,

        Paul








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          A/C Clutch Investigation 200 1993

          I went out and turned the ignition on but did not start the engine. Hit the AC switch and then watched the clutch plate move....but there appeared to still be an air gap. I grab some feeler gauges. The measurements were as follows:

          - clutch engaged - .020 inches
          - clutch disengaged - .048 inches

          I think specs for disengaged are .012 - .024

          So I am going to pop the clutch off and see how many shims are in there. I read a post on another forum about using plastic (bread bag flat plastic clips) to shim the outside of the clutch but I think I can remove the clutch easily without having to remove the entire compressor. Thoughts anyone.

          Oh by the way, if you not sure if the clutch is getting power, just turn on the ignition (don't start the engine), hit the AC switch and put a ferrous metal (feeler gauges or a screw driver) on the face of the the clutch. If it is energized it will grab the metal object. Sure is a lot simpler than probing for voltage in the wires.








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            A/C Clutch Investigation 200 1993

            I would do two things first.

            A. Pull a vacuum and see if the system is tight.

            B. Jumper the low pressure switch and dump a couple of 12 oz cans of R134 and see if you get compression and if the system is restricted or not. A empty compressor makes little to no noise. There is nothing to compress, and bet the low pressure switch kept it from coming on.

            Have a feeling you are about to remove something that is not the problem.

            Regards,

            Paul








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            A/C Clutch Investigation 200 1993

            You can remove all of the front without pulling the compressor.

            The disc has a threaded hole in the center. It accepts a threaded bolt body with wrench flats.

            The body has a center bolt that you turn to push against the inside shaft. This in turns pulls the disc off the shaft.

            Everything else is behind that.

            Phil








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              A/C Clutch Investigation 200 1993

              Phil,

              Trying to understand what you are communicating. The first bolt out is an allen head. After that I should see a center bolt that i will turn against the inside shaft?

              J.R.








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                A/C Clutch Investigation 200 1993

                Wanted to close this one out. Mission success. Summary as follows:

                - 1993 240s use the Seiko SS121DS5 compressor
                - Confirmed good 12v to compressor.
                - Confirmed good ground to clutch
                - With 12v to clutch, front of clutch would try to close and I could place a ferrous metal tool (screw driver) in front of the clutch and it would grab it (motor off of course)
                - Measured clutch gap. .048 inches open. .020 inches armed.
                - Spec clutch gap (not armed of course) is .012 inches to .024 inches
                - Found well prepared article to adjust gap http://www.saab9000.com/procedures/ventilation/airconclutch.php Pull the front of the air filter housing for access. no need to pull the fan belt. No puller is required. Once the 5mm bolt is off, just a little bit of movement side to side and the clutch face slides off.
                - in my case I found three shims: 2 at .016" each and 1 at .039". I removed the 2 .016 shims to net a .016 (.048 - 2*.016).
                - There was a very worn felt do-nut whose purpose is too wick the oil that seeps from the front seal over time (my theory at least). I removed it since it had lost its capability and I will seek a solution to install later (thoughts anyone for a source). Without it, oil will contaminate the clutch plate faces.
                - I reinstalled the clutch face, torqued the 5mm nut and used a .012 and .020" feeler gauges for go and no go.
                - Fired up the motor and armed the clutch knowing that I had a small leak. Shorted the low pressure switch, added about 8 ounces of R134 to confirm functionality, reinstalled the lower pressure switch connector and all is well.
                - next is to use my leak detector to find the 16 year leak. It still has the original charge. So here's hoping that it's an easy one.

                Cheers!







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