Volvo RWD 120-130 Forum

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Brake diagnosis? 120-130

Howdy all.

1967 130.

My brakes have never been great, but they recently took a turn for the worse...

Starting a month or two ago, my rear passenger-side wheel began locking up under the slightest bit of brake pressure.

I'd pull away from the house and stepping on the brakes as I approached the first stop sign a block away, that rear tire would lock up seemingly before any of the other three wheels were braking at all. It would lock up and I actually wouldn't feel like I was even slowing down that much at all. This would happen even at very low speeds (20mph).

After 5 or 10 minutes of driving, taking it easy on the brakes, the symptoms would go away and the brakes would feel "normal" again. But if I parked for any substantial period I'd have to do the minimal-braking routine all over again. Then last week it happened with the other rear wheel too.

I deduced that it must be a problem with the rear wheels. I confess that in 4 years and 15k miles I've never even inspected the rear brakes. I spent much of the last week trying to get my rear drums off. Thanks to previous posts on this board, I got a hold of the "proper" puller and, with far more force than I dreamed necessary, I finally got the drums off this evening.

Low and behold, everything looks relatively OK on both rears. One of the cylinders has leaked a couple drops, but fluid doesn't appear to have gotten on anything but the cylinder itself yet. The shoes have plenty of meat on them still. The adjusters turn freely. The drums don't have lips worn into them. Sure a little rust and a lot of dust, but all in all they seem much better than I'd imagined.

So upon seeing that, my new theory is that the FRONT brakes are the ones with the problem...

Does this seem reasonable? I apply pedal pressure, and the fronts, perhaps with their action being sticky or gummy, are not budging at first? They need to be worked a little before they want to play the slow-down game? So all action goes to the rears, which causes an easy lockup?

or could this be a proportioning valve issue?

Next question- now that I've got the rears apart, I think I'm going to go ahead and replace: shoes, wheel cylinders, and new hardware kit (I actually borrowed the drum puller from a friendly fellow on Craigslist, so I'd like to do all I can before I seal the drums back up).

why does IPD offer 1" bore as well as 7/8" bore cylinders for the Girling setup?

What's original? What's better? RPR only seems to list the 1" version in their section devoted to this car model.

As always, thanks in advance.

v

-----------------------------

PS-- if you're reading this because you're trying to get those stubborn rear drums off, you're frustrated and you found this post by search, follow the advice of those before me in years past:

- get your hands on the proper puller. A normal 3-claw puller won't do. You need the heavy duty steel flange type that bolts up to the wheel lugs. IPD version or equivalent.

- I tried heat (both hot water and torching), I tried liberal amounts of penetrating oil, and I tried beating things with a 3lb hammer; though I'm certain none of these hurt my cause, none seemed to do the trick. What finally did get the drums off was overcoming my fear of stripping the threads on the puller's jack screw, putting a 3ft cheater pipe on it and putting most of my weight into it. I estimate I applied about 300 ft-lbs of torque before the drum finally gave its satisfying pop. I really thought there was a good chance I was going to break the tool, but it turned out fine. (Put a good layer of grease on the threads if you're going to do this).

- Leave the castle nut on loose, so that when the drum decides to release it doesn't go flying.

- good luck.








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    Brake diagnosis? 120-130

    My guess is that something is binding in the rears... may look ok in there, but it's hard to see what could be up when the drum is off. Even harder to diagnose from where I sit...

    Adjustment would be step one. Second step will be to figure out what's wrong, and if you can't do so yourself... find someone that can. As George pointed out.. this is a significant safety issue...

    I do not think the problem is in the fronts.


    --
    -Matt I ♥ my ♂








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    Brake diagnosis? 120-130

    It really DOES take a lot to get the drums off. I'd guess that if you
    had smacked it with a hammer at 100 ft/lbs or left the lug bolts unscrewed
    about 3 turns and then tightened them up after getting the center screw good
    and tight it would not have required the use of the cheater.

    Right off no answer comes to mind as to why this problem is occurring but if I were you,
    I would carefully examine both rear brakes to see if there is a difference between them.
    Note that the leading shoe (the front one) is supposed to have a shorter lining than the
    trailing shoe. Also examine the linings closely to see if maybe one has had brake fluid
    or some other contaminant on it. If brake fluid squirts, it will get on the leading shoe
    first and may cause chattering or grabbing. There may be a problem with the braking system
    in general and it might be good to bleed all the way around. In the first car we got after we
    got married, a 1954 Buick convertible, the car had been in storage for a year or two.
    We had been married about a month and a half and were going out to dinner when a car we were
    following signalled a left turn and stopped. We were going about 35 mph and I applied the brakes
    but the car did not slow down so I got on them harder and suddenly the rear brakes locked up
    and I ended up hitting the rear of the car in front with the right rear of my Buick.
    In the process my wife went over the side, landing on her head. The ensuing hospital checkup
    revealed that she had a considerable knot on her head and that she was pregnant.
    Subsequent mechanical investigation revealed a gummy polymer filling the brake lines that prevented
    the front brakes from stopping the car.
    Those events set the financial tone of our marriage for many years to come, but the applicable truth
    for you in this case is, if you have been using DOT3 or DOT4 brake fluid, and especially
    if you suspect moisture contamination or you haven't changed brake fluid in some time, you
    should probably check out your system to avoid the kind of disaster I cited above. BTW we paid
    $425 for the Buick convertible and the estimate to repair the damage was about $500. We also had
    to repair the minor damage sustained by the car we hit. We got insurance the following week.....
    --
    George Downs, Bartlesville, Heart of the USA!







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