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With gas prices soaring to european heights, I have turned my attention from fixing my idle problems to the overdrive. It works, the relay is fine, and the solenoid works. It won't come on until it heats up for a while, about 20 minutes of driving in hot florida weather. In my quest I found this link (sorry, I suck at html):
http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Why_would_a_1988_Volvo_240_overdrive_only_work_after_a_long_drive_of_around_2_hours_or_more
What do you guys think about this?
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The explanation could be correct as an obstruction in the passage way leading from the top of the relief valve (RV) cylinder to the solenoid, and then to the bottom of the relief valve cylinder via another passageway, would prevent fluid from being able to properly pressurize the system.
However, drilling out this passageway isn't really the fix, IMHO. BUT if the shop that's working on it stands behind their work and the price is right, go for it.
I would first troubleshoot the problem and eliminate the first possible cause: The SOLENOID.
---if there's a chunk of something in there somewhere, that would give you the same symptoms. Take it out, blow it clean with a can of compressed air and then hold it vertically and shake it up and down. You should hear a faint clicking sound. We obviously know the solenoid works or you wouldn't get OD at all, but it's best to eliminate the easiest source first.
-----the next section is long, and if you don't feel comfortable working on the OD yourself, then bring it to a shop. I've just decided to blither on about the OD, so if you're interested, read on.
If the solenoid's not the cause, then it's time to clean the hydraulic system's passageways.
----Basically the system works like this: The pump pulls fluid in from the sump of the OD unit, pushes it past a ball valve into a passageway that leads to the "micro" filter, out of there via another passageway to the main actuating piston cylinders and then continues on through another passageway to the top of the relief valve. From there, it pushes down the top (small) piston in the RV, flows by back out 1 of two passageways (as the solenoid is blocking the end of the 2nd passageway) that leads to the mainshaft which provides lubrication for the rest of the OD unit. This is when the OD IS NOT ENGAGED.
----When the OD is engaged, this second passageway from the top of the relief valve is opened by the action of the engaged solenoid. The fluid flows through the ports in the shaft of the solenoid out into a passageway which has a pressed-in restriction, through that restriction and into the bottom chamber of the relief valve. When the fluid enters this bottom chamber, it forces the bottom (large) piston upwards, and through two different springs inside the large piston, forces the top cylinder (which was previously being pushed down) upwards. This action causes the pressure to build up in the system, and at a certain point the RV reaches an equillibrium. Ta-da, OD engaged.
In order to clean the system with the OD on the car, you have to drop the sump pan off the OD unit, remove the 3 plugs that contain the RV, micro filter, and pump respectively & remove the solenoid the test port plug bolt, which is right next to the solenoid. Clean the small filter element as well as the magnet which is glued to the bottom of the sump pan....and yes, there is a magnet...there will probably be a nice layer of steel gook on it...you can clean it with mineral spirits.
Once you've gotten your hands and arms covered in oil and maybe even gotten some on your face, you can wipe everything up and get to the compressed air portion of the task.
----You want to use the little straw nozzle and blow air from the bottom RV port TOWARDS the solenoid. Then blow out the drilling from the pump cylinder to the filter.
----Now, the only passage ways that you haven't blown out are the main piston circuit drillings....you can blow them out in any direction as well...I would do it from the micro filter side since any obstruction would pass out the RV port of solenoid port and you wouldn't have to run the risk of getting some crap in back of the pistons. While you blow the drillings you can alternately plug the top RV and solenoid ports.
These steps have worked for me and I've repeated the blowing out of passageways a couple times just to be sure, but I've also done this a few times....
The other thing that you run into when doing this job is the fact that you need to replace the sump pan gasket...(you can actually cut your own) or buy one from "ODGURU" here on the brickboard who can also provide just about all the hydraulic system parts for the OD. You can reuse the o-rings if they still look good.
Don't bother trying to remove much of the RV assembly...there's a sleeve and a top portion that most likely won't want to come out, so don't try to remove them.
It's not a quick project and you always run the risk of discovering more problems, but most likely the rest of the unit is ok. After everything is put back together, I would purge the system of air by rotating the driveshaft with the car in gear and the clutch in. This will cause the pump to move fluid through the system and get most of the air out. Of course, do this after you've filled the tranny back up. I use basic ATF type F if I remember correctly.
Put back on the solenoid and take the car out for a drive. You may find that the OD won't engage at first, but that can be caused by pockets of air, and I have found that to occur rarely (of course I get the rare occurrences--but I also repaced the actuating pistons & o-rings). I just drove around w/ the OD engaged and finally the air bled out of the piston cylinders and it's worked like a charm ever since......
As an afterthought, you'll want to get an adjustable spanner wrench to get the plugs out of the OD, and don't get a tiny one...get one with a handle. There is supposed to be a set amount of torque applied to these plugs, but you can feel when they want to stop, and you don't need to go crazy as the torque isn't very much at all.
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HI,THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR YOUR POST. Your explanation clear my long time confuse from last summer.
My 1986 245 +M46+OD definiterly have the same symptom. When I bought last summer, the weather is hot and I did nit have ant problem of the OD. But last winter, when the weather drop down, the OD would not engage untill I drive 10 minutes and the car got warm.
I checked the OD rely, wire and changed new trany&OD fluid. Nothing happend and the OD still refuse to engage untill 10 or more time drive and it got warn.
I suffered this for a whole winter. From this spring, when waether warn and hot, the OD works normal and easy engage whenever it is in 4th gear.
Hopefully I can fix it after the air flud+new fluid.
You mentioned :
"remove the 3 plugs that contain the RV, micro filter, and pump respectively & remove the solenoid the test port plug bolt, which is right next to the solenoid"
"----You want to use the little straw nozzle and blow air from the bottom RV port TOWARDS the solenoid. Then blow out the drilling from the pump cylinder to the filter.
----Now, the only passage ways that you haven't blown out are the main piston circuit drillings....you can blow them out in any direction as well...I would do it from the micro filter side since any obstruction would pass out the RV port of solenoid port and you wouldn't have to run the risk of getting some crap in back of the pistons. While you blow the drillings you can alternately plug the top RV and solenoid ports.
"
My question are:
Where thsee stufs loacted in th OD? like RV, micro filter, and pump respectively ,pump cylinder ,solenoid, main piston circuit drillings,solenoid port ?
Thanks.
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5 = solenoid
6 = test port plug
4 = drain to sump from mainshaft
3 = fine "micro" filter
2 = pump
1 = relief valve
Nice pictures. You should just paste in the legend to the numbers and post that pic on the FAQ of the brickboard. I could have used that long, long ago.
You'll need a 1" "narrow" open end wrench to remove the solenoid. There isn't enough width in there to get a conventional 25mm/1" open end on it. I used a 1" bicycle cone wrench, but it's outer diameter was too fat, so then took a 1" wrench and ground each side down to the proper width to fit that bolt.
Be careful removing the RV as once you get the plug out, some parts may just fall right out----slowly remove plug after you get it nice an loose, remove it slowly and with your other hand just put your index finger right in place of the plug....then you can see exactly how the RV is set up and not drop anything.
The fine filter is easy, nothing to lose...remember---that plug has a big washer on it.
The pump is easy too, but remember it's got a little spring and ball valve seated in the topside of the plug, so remove slowly and don't shake too much taking it out.
Good luck, any questions, just post.
Jason
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The reply on Wik is exactly right. I have the same experience. It is possible to clean out the channel to restore hydraulic flow.
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If you had to guess, how much would it cost to have the passageway cleaned?
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Justin,
What part of Florida? If you are in the Central area, let me know, and I can give you a hand sorting out the O/D problems.
Bill
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Tampa, actually. But I am stuck in Tampa unless the overdrive comes on, then I drive to ocala to my mechanic. I unfortunately I am limited by space and tools when it comes to repairs. Also, I had to get rid of my other car, so the volvo is my only ride now, which, sadly, I am thrilled about : )
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There is a shop in Tavares that only works on Volvo's and the occasional M/B. They normally have a long line waiting for service, since the other Stealerships in the Central Florida area are well known for charging for services that you don't always receive (my flame trap is a prime example). I'm a tad closer than is Ocala. E-mail me your info if you wish. Pageda is over in your area (Clearwater I think), and you might wish to talk with him too.
Bill
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Thanks man. Money is tight now, so I will address this next month since the problem has been narrowed down to just cleaning the overdrive and/or solenoid.
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