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I was doing some looking under my car last night and noticed that there is rust all over the steel brake lines where they run under the car. Shannon and I are going to put the brakes together this weekend with all new components (SS lines, wheel cylinders, shoes & turned drums), so I'm not sure whether its the best idea to trust my 40 year old lines. It may just be surface rust, but I don't want to find out otherwise if one decides to give out under heavy braking. On the Eastwood site I could get all I need to do the lines in both of my cars for about $100 including the steel tubing, flaring, cutter, and bending tools. I think it would a fun project to undertake and looks like it would go pretty smoothly if I follow the original patterns. I guess I could just reuse the fittings off the old lines if I can't find new metric ones online. I hope I'm not being over ambitious by considering running the lines myself......
I've also seen the pre-made lines from Classic Tube and others, but I'd like to do it myself and learn something while I'm at it (and save money).
Also does anyone know where I can find the screws that hold the wheel cylinder to the backing plate? They didn't come with my new wheel cylinders, and I couldn't find anything that would fit at my local hardware stores. I have some rusty ones that go to Wagner cylinders that I haven't checked yet (cars not at the same place) if they fit in my Girlings.
Any thoughts Brickboard?
Tyler
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I should add that the brake system on this car has been open to the atmosphere for an unknown period of time. Ordinarily I would not fret over the steel lines but I think Tyler is probably wise to consider changing them on this car.
Tyler, get a five foot section of steel line to practice bending, cutting, and flaring.
--
Mr. Shannon DeWolfe -- (I've taken to using Mr. because my name tends to mislead folks on the WWW. I am a 51 year old fat man ;-) -- KD5QBL
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They are UNC threads, I'm pretty sure. Look in your bolt box (bucket,
drawer, etc) and I'll bet you have got some that will fit.
What did you do with the ones you took out? A little time on the
wire wheel and they should be as good as new.
--
George Downs Bartlesville, Heart of the USA!
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George / Eric,
The problem is that when I got the car one wheel cylinder was detached and just cocked at an angle inside the drum, no screws to be found. I'm hoping the Wagners off my parts car might have suitable screws, as my search locally has not produced much. Maybe with I can go and look for some screws with 1/4 coarse US (UNC?) threads now that I know the size.
Thanks Eric for the heads up on all the line hardware sizes. I just figured they would be metric fittings, just like the line wrenches I used to take them off... I'll check the lines for any kind of pinches, ect..
Tyler
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Tyler;
You don't really need those fancy tube benders...just a rag, your hands and judgement...just don't bend tighter than a 2" radius...it's fun once yoU get the hang of it...and that doesn't take long!
In addition to good info from other posters, I'd recommend you wire brush and degrease the rusty lines...inspect and see what you have, surface rust or something more to worry about...if surface rust only, prime, including under clamps, with (OIL BASED BRUSH PRIMER) and paint (OIL BASED BRUSH PAINT), then replace clamps.
As far as the lost hardware, I'd reuse cleaned up hardware from a donor car ANY DAY before I used the chinese/taiwanese junk hardware available everywhere (you know, the kind you can easily cut to length with a kitchen knife).
Use anti-seize on everything in sight!
Cheers
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Ron,
Thanks for all your help with my posts and for all the info on your site. Brickboard, Sw-Em, and Vclassics are my escape from my corporate cubicle farm. I ended up sitting down last night with a few brews and a Dremel and cleaned / polished up my brake shoe adjusters. Shannon helped me get the first one free with a vice and generous amounts of PB and elbow grease. The other one now works like a charm too. I'm going to coat the threads and cams with anti seize and a bit of grease to keep the moisture out.
T
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Be aware that Volvo brake unions are unique, not in terms of thread, but in the fact that they don't have an unthreaded nose. If you use proprietary unions they will only engage on about one thread and are unsafe.
Personally I always replace the steel lines with Cupro Nickel. The copper ones don't take well to a single, or as you referred to them a bubble flare.
Calipers are single, much everything else is double, but look where they dgo and its obvious. I've seen pattern rear cylinders for Amazons with a single flare concave seat in them.
Pete
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Hello,
FYI, most of the hardware, ie nuts and bolts, are US coarse and US fine threads.
But I stress MOST of the hardware, there are some metric threads.
The bolts you need for the wheel cylinders is 1/4 coarse US threads.
You should use a lock washer as well.
Almost all the brake line tube nuts are US 3/8" fine thread for 3/16" double/inverted flare brake lines.
Although the original tube nuts required a 7/16" wrench to loosen and tighten, you can easily get new ones, but they are usually the style that uses a 3/8" wrench.
The only exception on the tube nuts is at the front calipers, where a bubble flare is used, which uses a different style of tube nut, but the threads are still 3/8" fine US threads.
Good luck,
Eric
Hi Performance Auto Service (formerly OVO or Old Volvos Only)
Torrance, CA 90501
BTW, rusty lines are not abnormal, what you should look for are pinched lines, espcecially where the exhaust goes over the axle.
Can't tell you how many right side brake lines I have had to replace because of muffler shop custom work.
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I've just read an article that outlines creating the buble flare for the front calipers. Correct me if I'm wrong, but it appears I can use the standard generic flaring tool for 3/16 line to make the bubble flare.
Making such a flare is easy: if you are in possession of a standard 45 degree double flaring tool, the bubble flare is what results after the first half of the operation. Simply stop there, and you have the bubble flare which will seat nicely at the bottom of the hole. If you continue, inverting the form tool and finishing the job, you then have the more familiar double flare used by Girling and the US automotive industry.
taken from: http://www.dimebank.com/BrakePlumbing.html
Shannon is right that the system has been sitting open to the environment for an unknown period of time. I figure it might be advantageous to make the lines for the system while I have it all apart.
maybe for the added safety since its a single circuit system.....
just my $.02
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Yup, my 164's got one of those. Doesn't leak though.
My auto local parts store has the material and tools to make new ones.
When I take it off I will take it over to him and get it done right.
He can also make brake and clutch cables.
--
George Downs Bartlesville, Heart of the USA!
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