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About a week ago, my 1995 850 GL with 220K miles starting having what I would call a "high speed miss". I could feel some hesitation only when accelerating on the highway. It quickly progressed to having drivability issues at all speeds. It starts and idles fine, but when accelerating it hesitates continuosly now. It does not "miss" when cruising at constant speed or decelerating and I cannot reproduce this by revving the engine in neutral.
I would suspect the transmission since it only happens when in gear but this is a manual and it happens in all gears, so unless there is some way the clutch could be at fault (it shifts fine), I don't see that.
Before posting this I replaced the fuel filter and ignition coil with no improvement. Spark plugs were replaced about a month ago and ignition wires are about 2 years and 20K miles old. So the only item not new in the ignition stream is the distributor.
Anyone seen symptoms like this before? Any other likely causes you can think of?
Thanks, as always, in advance.
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I saw your junkyard thread about the bumper/fogs. It was closed and I couldn't respond there.
I live just south of Chicago - Lansing, IL - and have a '96 850R. I'm not close to any good junkyards and I wondered if I could ask you to be "on the alert" for things. Would you mind letting me know if you find an 850 with the dark charcoal interior? I'd like to find a passenger rear door panel - I gouged mine when I had the passenger front seat pulled up and pushed back to the rear. I'd also like to get a full set of 850 seat skins to use as a patter so I can try my hand at sewing up replacements for my R interior.
There might be a thing or two else I need, but I can't think of anything else right now. If you'd let me know, I'd really appreciate it. Of course, if you come across a wrecked 850 with some good IPD parts that you already have, I'd be happy for that heads up, too.
Thanks, from one bricker to another,
OJ
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You might want to post in "picknpull" section:
http://www.brickboard.com/PICKNPULL
Let people know what you need.
I liKe the idea of creating new seat cushions. You can use the bottom front cushion from the passenger side as a pattern, it is the same for both front seats. The upper skins are the same, except for the hole for the lumbar support dial.
A good time to look for a new seat heater grid and a section of foam that is placed on top of it. Also to support the bottom bolsters with old blue jean patches, just glue them to the foam so the bolsters will give stronger support.
Klaus
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Always willing to listen, just not able to take direction.
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posted by
someone claiming to be fixit2002
on
Thu Dec 2 01:40 CST 2010 [ RELATED]
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Maybe try some different plugs. The problem seems to have started a couple weeks after they were changed. Weak or poor spark will show up under load.
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I wish I had listened to your suggestion sooner, Fixit. That could have saved me a lot of time chasing a non-existant vacuum leak and looking for spare parts for testing at the pick-n-pull.
I had changed the plugs a few weeks before this high speed miss started. At that time, I had a no-start and my plugs looked good visually so I bought cheap Autolite plugs just thinking installing them would eliminate plugs as the problem. When this fixed the no-start, I left those Autolites in.
Even though you suggested trying different plugs, I assumed even cheap plugs wouldn't go bad in just a few weeks so I discounted that. Finally, in frustration, I listened to you and bought Denso Platinum TT plugs (from sparkplugs.com for only a little over $4 each delivered). The car has had NO hesitation since they were installed. Just wish I had listened and gone back to basics sooner.
Thanks to all for your suggestions.
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Glad to hear that fixed the problem, though I think the general opinion is that platinum plugs won't last long ... best to stick with the Volvo plugs or equivalent.
--
'96 850T and '83 244 DL both at about 200K, '97 850T5; gone but not forgotten '81 245 and '64 Amazon
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Of course, you should have R&R'ed the distributer when you changed the plug wires, but that won't cause a problem with the engine under load.
I would check the vacuum line fron the fuel pressure regulator (at the end of the fuel rail by injector #1) for cracks. If it has never been replaced, replace the old line anyway. While you are at it, check the vacuum tree for leaking 'dummy' caps. I suspect you are not getting enough vacuum due to a leak.
Klaus
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Always willing to listen, just not able to take direction.
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That's what I love about the Brickboard; good ideas that might never had occurred to me unless you mentioned them.
I like the vacuum idea and not just because it should be a lot easier to fix than a fuel pump. The engine is probably positioned differently under load so it could open up a gap in the hose or plastic. I'll be out in the cold tomorrow looking to see if I can find a leak.
Thanks for turning me on to this possibility, Klaus.
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Check the air hose between the air filter and the throttle body first. The accordian section could be cracked, allowing in air.
I thought the Fuel Pump relay was the same for 1998 and 1995. They both say 103 on the top... Fuel pressure regulator is different, the 1995 has a vacuum hose from the FPR to the vacuum tree next to the throttle and the hose must be dry and not smell from gasoline.
Klaus
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Always willing to listen, just not able to take direction.
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I was going by the eEuroparts parts list, which is usually pretty good and when you go to an item there it will list all the models the part fits. That site shows KAE 3565803 for '95 850s and KAE 9434225 for the '98 XC-70 I have.
HOWEVER, FCP Groton shows the same as eE, except they list a different part for '95 850s with manual transmissions (like mine) and that is the same part at the '98 (KAE 95434225). So I might be in luck.
Now my question is where is the Fuel relay located in each of these models?
I checked for vacuum leaks and though I could tell a long story here, I'm convinced not the issue.
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The fuel pump relay is in the same place for both of your cars. Engine bay fuse box, the one closest to the window. It's too cold to check, but the 103 relay is either right up there with the fuses, or under the fuse tray. If under, take out the 3 Torx screws and lift the top of the tray cover off.
Klaus
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Always willing to listen, just not able to take direction.
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I was driving this car last night on the highway and when I let off on the trottle, the engine stayed racing as though my foot were still on it. I believe the pedal stayed somewhat depressed too. That went away after a while and hasn't recurred, but it makes me think that either there is either a problem with the trottle istself (probably inside the throttle body) or a very large vacuum leak after the air flow meter (thought that would mean I was wrong about the pedal staying down). I inspected it all from the outside again this morning and finding nothing I headed to the local pick-n-pull because their site said they had recently gotten in a '95 850. I was hoping to get everyting from the AFM to the throttle body to have replacements before I took mine apart.
Turns out someone had beaten me too most of that, and this one was a turbo besides. I did get a throttle body though and also the fuel relay. You were right Klaus, both my car and that turbo had the red 103 relay. Already replaced that just to see and no improvement.
But does my analysis of the new clue of "sticking throttle" make sense to you guys?
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Throttle bodies normally don't need replacing, just thorough cleaning. The spring on the throttle is quite strong, so use lithium grease on the linkage fittings and the center bearing of the spool.
BTW, are you using regular gasoline instead of premium? The NA engines have 10:1 compression, you may be getting knock sensored with 87 octane.
Klaus
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Always willing to listen, just not able to take direction.
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I've used 87 octane all along in it without problems, but it was low so I tried a tank of 91 with no change.
I found a fuel pressure gauge with a 40 inch hose and while the Actron CP7838 - Professional Fuel Pressure Tester Kit looks like a quality item and has a fitting that seems to fit the schrader valve it will NOT work because there is now way to fit the hose, with the necessary adapter, between the valve and the the bracket for the throttle cable pulley. Since you can't drive the car with that bracket moved, I was unable to test the fuel pressure.
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Perhaps fuel pump relay too. If you can't check fuel pressure while driving i'd start with the relay. It has two modes one for low operation and one for high, perhaps the high one isn't working correctly and your not getting enough fuel... I believe there's a way to test, I'll look into it and get back with you. However, a fuel pressure gauge with a long enough hose that you can read it from the drivers seat would be preferred...
--
If you're not driving it "like its stolen," are you really driving?
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I'll see if I can scare up a very long fuel pressure gauge, but someone educate me on why the engine would need more fuel pressure when in gear at 2K rpm than in neutral at 2K rpm.
I didn't know that the relay was more complicated than the ones in my RWD Volvos so I could see where one part could be bad. I'd love to hear of a test for that since that's one part I can't swap out from my '98 V70.
Thanks for the idea.
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The car has to push all that air out of the way when it is on the road.
Greg
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It doesn't really need 'more pressure' at high load, it needs the pump running stronger because its using a ton more fuel. The easiest way to test if both modes are working is hooking an ammeter to the fuel pump fuse (something makes me want to say #2, but not certain) and watch the current jump as you increase revs (you should be able to see with just running in the driveway now that I think about it).
The added gauge helps to ensure the pump is providing enough pressure at load, which could be the fault of the pump, the regulator, and probably something else I can't think of right now. It can be drawing enough current, but if its not using it correctly it won't matter (a stuck pump will draw infinite current [well until some wire shorts and eliminates the short circuit])... It getting more current will remove the relay from suspicion though...
--
If you're not driving it "like its stolen," are you really driving?
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Check your fuel pressure.
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And you can tape the fuel pressure gauge to the windshield so you can see it while driving; the thought of routing a pressurized gas line into the passenger compartment sounds a bit dodgy....
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