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Here goes...
Check engine light came on about a month ago. Tried to have it checked at my local mechanic but no codes appeared when hooked up and the light just went off on its own. However, it came on and stayed on shortly thereafter. So I took it to the dealer to have the code read. They said the code that came up was showing that the throttle module would have to be replaced. I noted nothing abnormal about performance to them. Now a month later she is showing symptoms of hesitation. I really notice it at speeds between 55 and 70. The easiest way to describe it is that it feels like the brakes were tapped for a second.It's getting worse. The check engine light has not come back on again. 2 years ago she was idling funny and my local mechanic just removed the throttle cover and cleaned and all was good. But now he says that won't fix this.
Dealer estimate a month ago was $1050 to replace the throttle module. Augh! Help! Is there any other fix than this?
Thanks in advance!
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Over at Volvoforums there is a discussion where the ETM was the suspect but turned out to be a bad ground. You might check this out first.
http://www.volvoforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=44999
Jerry
01 V70 T5a wirh 115K
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There is a Canadian outfit that will do it for 1/2 the dealer price, but you or your mechanic will have to send them yours.
www.xemodex.com
Klaus
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Two great Volvos, a 1967 220 and a 1998 V70R
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Klaus!
Is this module the accelerator pedal p/n 30683516??
I put in the new MAFSensor yesterday in my S60T5 and it was fine for a while
but now it won't idle and is thus BARELY driveable.
I'll make a separate post.
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George,
The throttle module is the expensive part, know to go bad from 1999-2002. Usually it throws a couple of codes and the CEL.
If you have been clearing the codes and it runs for a little bit and then limps, go visit www.xeModeX.com - cheaper than a dealer and will work forever.
Klaus
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Two great Volvos, a 1967 220 and a 1998 V70R
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I have about decided to try the oxygen sensor first. It is specifically mentioned in the
stuff the other guy cited related to the only code I have seen, P1171.
My mechanic has one, and I am in enough of a scrape for transportation at the moment
that I am willing to pay him $111 more than FCPGroton wants. (The difference will be less
since I won't have to pay any shipping.)
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http://forums.swedespeed.com/showthread.php?43570
http://www.volvo-forums.com/t10577-p1171-code.htm
--
Two great Volvos, a 1967 220 and a 1998 V70R
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Very interesting, Klaus!
I greatly appreciate your research into this matter.
I'm keeping the 045 MAFSensor since it did not seem to fix the problem.
Do you know what kind of spray cleaner they are using? Is it a carb cleaner?
Many thanks!
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No, carb cleaner is too harsh. It is a specific cleaner dedicated to MAF which leaves no residue. Remember, the MAF sensor cannot be touched or rubbed.
If you want to try, unplug the MAF before engine start. This will generate a CEL condition, but that's OK. It should idle fine but run poorly. Turn the engine off, plug the MAF back in and if the MAF is bad, the engine will idle poorly. Never plug/unplug a MAF with the engine on.
Klaus
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Two great Volvos, a 1967 220 and a 1998 V70R
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I unplugged the MAFSensor and started it up. It idled fine for about 30 seconds and then
started being rough and very rich, with black smoke.
I shut it down and plugged it back in and it was pretty much the same.
I still suspect the Oxygen sensor, probably the front one.
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What is CEL?
Hard to believe that a new MAFSensor should be bad within 50 miles of installation....
I'll give it a try.
I thought the D-jet MAPSensor was a pain!
Many thanks!
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CEL = check engine light, ie., error code.
If your mechanic touched the sensor, that would make most sense. I never trust a dealer unless he shows me all of the codes on the scanner, and lets me right them down.
Klaus
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Two great Volvos, a 1967 220 and a 1998 V70R
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He didn't take it apart. I saw him install it.
After he installed it it didn't show any codes. I drove it about 35 miles at around 4500
rpm hoping to clean the oxygen sensor, and when I got back it was still not showing any codes.
On the way home the check engine light was on and it actually flashed a few times as it
started to idle poorly.
The car has 100,000 miles on it so it probably is time for an oxygen sensor.
Planning to try that Monday. I drove it over to his shop (with considerable difficulty)
this afternoon.
From what I have read at various places (some at your suggestion) it seems that the throttle module
would give a different code from P1171.
There is a guy in Canada who is offering a DiCE and VIDA for about $800 on ebay.
I'm wondering if I oughta spring for it.
(Sure wouldn't be any help on the oldtimers!)
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At 100K, I would start looking for gross vacuum leaks around the manifold. That would cause over rich condition - black smoke. The leaks would also cause the O2 sensor to over compensate the unmetered air.
Klaus
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Two great Volvos, a 1967 220 and a 1998 V70R
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I had mentioned the possibility of vacuum leaks to the mechanic also and he said he looked it
over pretty carefully.
I would think that gross vacuum leaks would also make it idle very fast, which it does not.
With a turbo, the vacuum leaks would be overcome by the boost pressure making it more normal at
higher speeds, which it seems to be, but the instantaneous gas mileage is running around 16
or more which seems like something is definitely wrong.
I'll mention vacuum leaks again to him on Monday when I go over there.
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My 1998 V70R has 185K miles and I suspect that the front O2 sensor is starting to fail, the mpg is not what I would like it to be. Unless abused and very dirty, the O2 sensors do last a long time.
Because yours is a turbo, check all of the inter-cooler connections as well as the throttle body connection. After I had replaced all of my PVC stuff, the throttle body connection was not tight: It idled fine, but as soon as I gave it boost, the connection came loose and I barely made it back home. I couldn't tell at first glance that it was loose, it wasn't until I started twisting the connections that I realized what the problem was.
Keep looking,
Klaus
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Two great Volvos, a 1967 220 and a 1998 V70R
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Klaus!
The S60T5 is back together with a new oxygen sensor and thus far seems to be OK.
So I guess I have a spare MAFSensor for whichever car needs it next. In any case
it sure is nice to have 2 cars among 4 people rather than just 1!
Many thanks for your input!
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Good point! My S60T5 was in an accident and has had the radiator, Intercooler and AC condenser replaced, as well as the grille, "bumper" and hood, so it is certainly possible some of that stuff is not tight.
I plan to print out all this stuff tomorrow before I go over to the shop Monday.
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Thanks for the quick response! :)
However, is their any other fix? I feel that all they did was hook her up, do a scan and just read me the stored code. Then read me a "laundry list" of things that needed to be done. ie. basic maintenance that I could have done at my by far cheaper mechanic.
Is it possible it could be something else? I didn't note this earlier but the cruise control is acting up too. Could this be related?
Thanks again!
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Your cruise control interracts with the ETM, electronically, so it will also act 'strange'. Drivability will get worse with time. If you remember the code the dealer got, send that code to XeModeX in an email and have them verify it. They will have a list of error codes.
I would not let a dealer replace the ETM. First, it costs too much, and second, it will not last.
Klaus
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Two great Volvos, a 1967 220 and a 1998 V70R
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Makes sense. Went by my mechanic today and ordering the part for overnight delivery by Friday.
As always, thanks for the advice! :)
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These units fail and need to be replaced.
It's XeMoDex for 1/2 the price and lasts forever, or OEM which costs 2x as much and will only last a few years.
The choice is yours of course, but I think eventually you'll have a hard time keeping the engine running at all. That throttle module is what opens your throttle body for you and lets air in the engine... without it your pretty much fubar'd.
--
1998 V70 AWD->FWD Turbo 200k+
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Thanks for the advice. She is getting worse and my mechanic tried to "clean her up a bit" but I know its only a temporary fix.
Getting her fixed Friday. :)
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