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I don't know what to do - I am looking at buying a used V70XC (good price of $3500 with 119,000 miles). Known problem is an oxygen sensor, and I am going to have a dealer do a full check of the car, but having read all about the problems I am worried. Consumer reports lists it as a car to avoid. I am used to a 240 - mine has over 250,000 miles now. I have driven 240's for over 20 years. I will not be happy if this car is a money pit where only a dealer can fix it. I usually use an independant mechanic. The seller has some records of service at 90,000 miles, and at 111,000 he got the timing belt and water pump replaced, which in a 240 is the big expense. I prefer a wagon. Should I just keep looking for an old 850?What should I do? Help!!!
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First question to ask yourself, Do you need AWD? The answer is probably no, so why look at the XC. The price should not be the determining factor. It was nice that the owner defered the Tbelt an extra 5,000 miles. I wonder what else he defered?
So long as your 240 is still running, you do not have to rush into anything. The plane Jane V70s are good cars like the 240, IF they have been maintained.
$3500 is a good price for a 1999. Just remember, that in that price range you will probably have to spend an additional $1000 to get it into trustworthy shape. The O2 sensor is no big deal, but it also needs to have the flame trap replaced and all of the vacuum elbows. Dealers don't do that kind of work because they make more money if the rear main seal blows.
Klaus
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The more I learn, the more I forget. So why learn?
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The mileage is not too bad IF it has been properly maintained. With any car at this age, condition and previous history is critical.
Ponder your transport needs: do you really really need AWD? Can you get by with FWD and snow tires?
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Thank you so much for responding.
I do not care at all about the AWD. I just want a wagon/hatchback type design because I invariably haul stuff. I wish I could FIND a good old regular Volvo wagon, but I have had 240's so long I have not kept up with other Volvos models. Now a 240 for me is getting really impracticle because I am a 50 something single woman who does not want to worry about her car breaking down on the road and then worry about parts, etc. After reading all the complaints, I am scared about taking this car on. I looked at the history, he has been taking it to get it serviced but nothing for the last 8,000 miles except oil changes. The check engine light is on, he says it is an oxygen sensor and I am now trying to determine who told him this and how long the light has been on. The dealer's service guy says that if the O2 sensor has been broken too long, it may have ruined ("fouled") the catalytic converter. I want a "good old reliable" wagon, and do not need anything fancy. Just reliable and not so complicated that you have to take it to a dealer to get it fixed. I read about the horror of having glycol leak into the transmission and kill that, so I will shell out $135 or whatever ridiculous price they want to check that there is no glycol in the trans fluid.
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Hi Tracey, while I don't exactly agree with the "Run from this car" mentality, an early Volvo AWD may not be the best option for you if you prefer simplicity over AWD. The AWD system adds weight and complexity which inevitably means many things will be tougher to work on yourself and will take more money to maintain.
$3500 at 119K miles sounds rather tempting. At that mileage it has another 30-50K left in it before most things are due to start breaking, wearing out, and becoming a more or less constant bother to keep fixing. 8,000 miles with nothing but oil changes sounds right to me. It shouldn't need much else. That said, even with service records in hand the current owner of this particular car has shown that he doesn't really care for it (the service light). That's not a good thing, and is indicative that there may be more issues under the surface. I wouldn't get hung up on a POTENTIAL tranny/glycol issue. That's a new one to me.
For a "good old reliable" wagon I would tell you to find an 850 but good ones that don't need a bunch of work are becoming hard to find.
Here's how I've been looking at it. If I'm going to go with an XC I'll buy the best, newest, lowest mileage example I can find and afford --avoid the fixer-upper. I don't know about your area but around here there are many to choose from. For a FWD 850/V70 I'll compromise on condition, maintenance history etc. because they are harder to come across and I'm more comfortable about the cost to maintain and ease to wrench on.
Good Luck,
Will
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854 - 244 - Mini
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Thank you. For the price, nothing in Baltimore or Washington metro areas beats it because of the relatively low mileage. That compared with service records and if the dealer comes back with the report that it looks OK I will probably go with it. If the charges to get it fixed are over 400 or 500 I will probably pass, unless the owner comes down on price. He does not appear to be hurting for money, so he may come down a bit more. In the meantime, I do continue to look.
The recall throttle item was fixed - that doesn't come back again, does it?
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I'll definitely get behind this opinion will.
I recently ran in to some of the high-mileage AWD problems myself, and I don't think it was really that big of a deal. I really liked the AWD, but when the components started acting up I took the center driveshaft out in about an hour and made my car FWD. No problems at all. Many people have done this. Now my car is essentially a FWD with a sweet LP turbo and pretty respectable ground clearance (which admittedly means the handling is not quite as good).
I'll agree this is probably not the most reliable car on the planet, but if you're willing to make some sacrifices on what the car is capable of (ie: get rid of AWD when it becomes a problem) then I think it's just as reliable as the regular FWD cars.
If you do a search on here you'll find there are some things to look into doing right away, though none are very expensive, esp if you do them yourself.
flush the tranny fluid
flush the brake fluid
make sure the timing belt has been done on schedule and get it done ahead of schedule for next time. (You probably don't need to think about a new waterpump until closer to 200k.)
flush the coolant and get a new OEM thermostat
check/replace the PCV system
replace the vacuum hoses
the MIL is a bit disturbing. Find out what that's all about.
Actually, get the codes read and report them here so we can tell you all about them!!!
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1998 V70 AWD Turbo 190k+
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By "MIL" do you mean mileage? The car has not been used much in the past two years because the man's wife died, and she was the principle user of the car. He does use the car, but has two others. I am trying to find out about how and why he thinks it is an Oxygen sensor that is the reason the check engine light is on. I have an appointment at a dealer where he took it for the last few services, they will give me the codes (on Tuesday, only six days away) but I will be forced into a decision right away because they do the State inspection ($100 rip off) but I would rather the dealer do the inspection than another unknown place because I know the dealer is going to be very picky and give me everything that looks wrong with it. So I will be spending about $350 already just for all the inspections ($125 just to scan it). So before Tuesday, I really need to know where I will draw the line and walk away.
Timing belt and water pump were done at 111,000 (now at 119,000).
I am the kind of person who gets a car and keeps it until it really won't go any more, like my 240 with 250,500 miles that now needs new seals. So I want to really love the car. I love the way it looks, it seems comfortable, and as to the gas mileage issue: other people with a light foot get better than the 18/22 gas mileage. I don't plan to floor it to use the turbo either. So I am expecting much higher gas mileage. (I would get nearly 30 mph highway with my beloved 240).
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FYI
MIL = Malfunction Indicator Light = Check Engine Light
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1998 V70 AWD Turbo 190k+
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Why would you be paying for a state inspection if it's not yet your car? I'm confused. Could you get the car to an Autozone of Advance Auto type parts store? Call ahead but usually they will loan you an OBDII scanner which you can use to get and clear the codes. It's easy and it's free.
-Will
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854 - 244 - Mini
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Also if you're willing to spend $125 to have them read your codes once, why not go buy a code reader for ~ $125 - $150 and read any code you want anytime? Seriously I see them go on sale here at Can Tire for $99 CAN. It's a fairly basic code reader, but certainly capable of reading the code and clearing them to turn the light off.
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1998 V70 AWD Turbo 190k+
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OMG (Oh my GOD) I had no idea it was so easy to do that. I will see if I can have that done. I was going to pay for the inspection at the dealer's as part of the overall inspection I wanted to have done on the car to see what was wrong with it, since the two inspections overlap, kill two birds with one stone. In my state (Maryland) you go to a private facility to have the state inspection done, then a state facility for emissions. This of course leads to many "purchased" inspections, but I really need to know the status so I need a "real" inspection.
To complicate my predicament, I saw a 95 850 GLT wagon today with 150,000 miles, runs OK but only has records for three years. They had it three years and 25,000 miles of a few long trips and other than that suburban driving. Prior to that, it was an auction car. They had all service performed at a Firestone shop, never went to a Volvo mechanic. They has the main seal replaced, the radiator replaced, the A/C compressor replaced. I am worried about timing belt and water pump, and tie rods - I thnk those are the things that go bad. I need to find a site that tells me what service needs to be performed at how many miles, etc. so I can get an idea of what it is behind on. Is there a place to look that up?
Thanks to all helping me, I REALLY appreciate this.
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'95 is my favorite year for 850s... It has the OBDI diagnostic system instead of OBDII. No scanner needed, just a little diagnositc port that gives up codes via flashs of a little red LED. I bought my '95 five years ago with no records. Later got a carfax, turns out it had changed hands five times. The leather had been neglected and it's always used a little oil, but otherwise it's worked out fine.
If the rear main seal was replaced that indicates that there was a blockage in the crankcase ventilation system, a common ailment if not fastidiously maintained. If they didn't resolve those issues then a new seal will only fail again. Check underneath for oil drippage.
Timing belt, water pump and tie-rods are all normal wear items. Any car will eventually need them. The interval for timing belt replacement is 70K miles so it was due at 70 and 140K. If there is no record or sticker under the hood then it should be replaced ASAP. The 5-cyl is an interference engine. A broken belt means broken cylinder head.
The water pump is about due. Mine was weeping a small amount of coolant past the shaft at ~125K. Others have reported no problems till close to 200K. While you're under the car looking for oil leaks, look for split rubber boots on the ball joints, tie-rods and sway bar links. Even better listen for clunks and groans from the suspension while driving. Factor needed maintenance into your offer.
Make sure that the AC works. Adjust the power seat to make sure all functions work. A broken cable is common but fixable. Another bargaining chip.
Oh and on the V70XC AWD system -- you don't get to choose whether it's on or off. Its function is automatic and seamless. The only way to "turn it off" is to remove the driveshaft to the rear.
Good luck!
-Will
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854 - 244 - Mini
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great advice Will.
On this car, I would think about the following.
- AC - if you really want AC and you don't have records that show that the evaporator was changed, then someday you'll be in for a $2000 repair. The car will work without it of course, but if it's something you want you'll have to have this in the back of your mind. Weird that the compressor was changed - I haven't heard anyone complaining of this failing, though there is the infamous 'clutch shimming' fix...
- PCV - depending on the mileage since this was last done you might be looking at this if they've been replacing seals. Of course, this system needs inspection/maint/attention no matter what.
- interior will likely not be in as good shape as your 1999 option
- the on-board code reader system is awesome
FWIW I just replaced my original water pump at 195k miles and it was in great shape - no play in shaft, no leaking/weeping at all. Just did it as a matter of course when doing timing belt - no sense mucking about with a job like that.
Also FWIW I just removed the driveshaft and disabled the AWD on my car. The job was not difficult, the car drives fine with only a hint of torque steer and I probably only notice it because the AWD used to feel so good - AND my gas mileage is WAY better (I'll be posting about that sometime soon).
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1998 V70 AWD Turbo 190k+
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Thank you so much. All this information really helps me. I am so grateful for your time.
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I think you better run from this car. There are two big negatives:
1. AWD. If you don't need it, avoid.
2. Check engine light is on. Previous moron did not check what was wrong.
If you need a simple and reliable car, an AWD 1999 V70XC does not fit that criteria. This will become a money pit for you.
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Thank you for respondng to me, I appreciate it.
As to the AWD, I had no plans to turn it on EVER unless we got some huge snowstorm (I live near DC/Baltimore, this happens once every ten years). I was going to let sleeping dogs lie, as it were, on the AWD. Am I wrong in assuming that unless you turn on the AWD you are not tempting problems with it?
Are you speaking from your own experience with one or are you a mechanic?
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AWD isnt something the driver turns off or on in a Volvo. In 1999 it is to be avoided all together.
I vote for a 1998 V70 FWD. Most reliable car I've ever owned!
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