So I've been shopping for a good used Volvo wagon and have primarily been looking at 240s and 740s when i came across a low mileage, well maintained 850. Intrigued, I set out to do some research. What I came up with were results like the ones that can be found at the link that follows:

http://www.carsurvey.org/viewcomments_review_16267.html

Is the 850 really such a lemon or does it just need a lot of TLC?

It is understandable that different people have different experiences. Our experience with a 1995 turbo sedan 850 is that it has been the best car I have ever driven, including several BMWs, MBs, Lexuses, Acuras, and Porsches. For example, its road hugging in snowy/rainy weather has been truly outstanding; it seems like we go at 55 mph among ... stopped cars! 13.5 years later, it is still truly outstanding.

Interestingly, it has been less expensive to maintain than our other cars that had been Japanese (one Toyota Corolla and one Nissan Altima).

162k 1995 turbo sedan 850

So ct, you still have your '95 after buying it new?

I've had the same experiences you've had with both my 850s ('93 and '96). Both were, and are, cheaper to maintain than my previous two vehicles, a '97 Jeep Grand Cherokee and an '89 Toyota pickup.

Yes, I still have it. It has been pure fun so far.

On the other hand, we got rid of the Japanese cars; now we have a new S60 (light turbo) that my wife drives.

That's wonderful, ct. Yes, my current '96 850 has but a mere 84k on it. It's currently in storage for the winter. I've been driving my mother's XC70 ('03) around for transportation- like your S60 light-turbo, it's a fun car to drive.

read post here:
http://www.brickboard.com/AWD/index.htm?id=1242562

Hey Curious,
We've had our 850T for over 3 years now and to date nothing major in repairs.
Yes, there have been a few things that should not wear out go on it, but these were relatively inexpensive to fix. If you're handly, given the age these cars are getting to there should be more used parts available.
I wouldn't hesitate to recommend an 850 to anyone with basic wrench turning abilities. Do your research regarding routine maintenance. As for repairs, in addition to this great site there are quite a few others (ie: Bay 13) that have great step-by-step instructions with photo's. Another thing about the car which I could also say about our 760 is that they make sense in their design and engineering which makes things a lot easier when digging around to make a repair. Given a choice between the 760 we retired 3 years ago and the 850 we now drive I would give the 760 a slight edge in reliability, but give the 850 a large advantage in performance.
(Just make sure you buy one that hasn't had the s**t driven out of it.)
NBZ
--
Luck favours the prepared.

Time for my 2 cents worth. I have a 1996 with 307,000 miles on it and do the nromal maintenance myself such as engine oil/tranny oil changes and brakes and struts and whatever else i can reasonable expect to do a decent repair on.
I bought mine with 192k on it. I now have 307k and needing cam/crank seals replaced at this time. Here is what i have had to do to keep it in good running order.
Odometer gears - Myself
Struts - ""
Brake Calipers - ""
Gas Pump in tank - ""
ABS unit repaired - "" sent out part to reputable brickbaord repairer
Top Engine Mount - Dealer
Air Pump(twice)and not doing it again until emissions test in 2 years - Dealer
AC Evaporator - Dealer
Starter and Ignition switch - Dealer and myself
Wheel bearings passenger side - Myself

I bought the car for $4k and have probably put that back into the car to maintain and gotten back 110,000 miles of enjoyment and plan on getting 400k on this car before i retire it. Sounds like a lot of money but i just love driving this thing!!!

Marty in CT

Marty,


Wow, you have 307k miles on your '96? How did you manage to put on so many miles after purchasing the car?

I also have a '96, but it has a mere 83k on it, so I have quite a ways before I catch up to you. Right now my car is currently sitting in my garage because I put it in storage for the winters. It's not coming out again until April

The 850 is always going to loose in a head to head comparison with a similarly maintained red engine car. The interiors on the 850 always seem to explode out past 150k or so, they are way too plasticky and the driver's leather seat panels always wear out. Even if they both had the same laundry list of items that typically go bad it is going to cost you more to maintain the 850. Just off the top of my head the things that I routinely recommend on 850's:

Heater cores
a/c evaporators
engine mounts
torque stay bushings
control arms and/or bushings
breather boxes
radiators
timing belt tensioners and idler pullies
water pumps
fuel pumps
ignition contact plates
odo gears
dash light bulbs
struts and spring seats
engine oil pick up seals
assorted rotted vacuum lines
abs control units
axles and boots
ball joints
front hub/bearing assemblies

All that being said, seeing as how I own and run a Volvo repair shop, I wish the whole darn world drove them. There is no money working on good cars.

Mark

I bought my 96 850 new. I have had many cars over the years, but never kept one as long as this 850--I still have no desire to trade as this is the best car I have ever had. Yes, they do require a little maintenance to stay ahead of the game and I do most of it myself (only Mobil 1 for crank and ATF). Do the common sense things like replacing fluids regularly, treat the leather with Leatherique, change the timing belt when required, etc., and this car should run well over 200K miles reliably. Mine still looks new and will blow the doors off many. There have been posts here with 350K+ miles.

So If you have found a well maintained 850, go for it!
--
96 850T, Bilstein HD, IPD swaybars-HD endlinks

So far so good with my 93 GLT. Bought mine almost a year ago.

After reading all the negative comments on the RWD forum, I was somewhat scared of the 850.

Just did new rear brake pads, have done tie rod ends and will need a new A/C drier before next summer. Could use new struts, but I'll hold off on that for now...

This car was well maintained by an old lady. Not pretty, but not too bad either. However, she runs like a champ!

Just read on the RWD forum where a guy paid $1700 for a 240 with 226K on the clock. Why? Good 93-95 850's can be found for similiar money.

IMO - drive a lot of 850's first before buying one. After a little while you'll be able to tell a well-maintained car from a NOT well-maintained one. My 93 is faster and drives better than any NA car I've driven. Maintenance is even more important on a turbo. Records are key, of course :)


--
93 850GLT 100k - my new daily driver - former little old lady's car :) 90 244DL 278k

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In my experience, limited to three years, the 850 is very reliable. It needs to be taken care of though. Yes, there are many things that commonly go wrong on them. But I would think that is the case on most cars after 100,000 miles and 10 years. The good news is #1, this board is here. #2, if you find a car that has been maintained (like I did) the hardest part is over. Actually, from what I have seen, #2 is imperative. I can't imagine what life would have been like if I had bought one that was not taken care of.

Klaus and BG stated *extremely* good advice. Klaus' was in a single sentence paragraph near the end of the post. BG's was in his last sentence. Read them again and take them to heart.

If you get one in decent shape, the worst you will probably face is stuff like spring seats, brake maintenance, CV joint replacement, seat back cable failure, tranny fluid replacement and routine maintenance on the engine (TB cleaning). Oh yeah, the odometer gear breaks. But there is a replacement available. Working on this car has actually become fun. It is built well. If you get one that has not been maintained, from what I have seen you are asking for real trouble.

Lemon? No. I love my car, and I know many others who own and work on them that feel the same way.

'95 854T 185K

I have owned a 1993 GLT since new. It runs great and is a joy to drive. Nothing major wrong at 120k miles, only consumables. It has been serviced at all appropriate mileages and that is why it is trouble free. Parts do cost a bit and things wearout over time. I would buy any well cared for 850. Wish they still made them new.

The 850 needs to be maintained. And if you expect the dealer to do it, you are wrong. I have seen cars with oil coming out of the oil cap, and the dealer just puts a new seal on it! That will cause the RMS to leak and other seals to blow. But they don't want to do little things like vacuum lines or oil breather lines.
If you are maintaining an 850 yourself, or have a very good indie, then you have a good reliable car for a few hundred thousand miles.
At least it isn't a BMW! Their water pumps are only good for 40K, the trannies for 120K and engines for 150K miles. Mercedes has problems with all of the bushings, and gobbs of money for a new head gasket.

Buying used requires a lot of trust in the sellers words, and service documentation is worth a lot of money.

Klaus
--
The 164 has a new home, all I am left with are a 95 854T and a 98 V70R :)

It seems to me that the engines and trannies in the rear wheel drive Volvos are good for way over 120k and 150k respectively.

I wouldn't say that for the 6 cylinder 960. The 850/70 5 cylinder engines are at least equal to the 4 cyl red blocks. The trannies are also good if they get flushed once in a while.
Going 200K in an 850/70 is no big deal, but routine maint of the oil breather system is a must. Just like the RWD Volvos.

Klaus
--
The 164 has a new home, all I am left with are a 95 854T and a 98 V70R :)

I'm at 175k and my car uses *no oil* between routine changes. The clutch is original too. Albeit fairly noisy.

I sure hope Klaus is wrong about Bimmers because I just bought one. ;)

-BTC

'98 V70T5 5-speed manual, 175,000 miles, heated velour cloth comfy chairs, IPD front stabilizer bar, factory rear bar and HD suspension, Bilstein HDs, Volvo strut tower brace & skidplate, Euro aspheric split-view mirror, XC grill, C70 jewel E-code headlights, Lidatek LE30, V-1, JB Weld, Duck tape, Zip-ties, Mobil-1 always

BMWs before about 1995 were robust and extra-reliable. Then cost-cutting came along, with some environmental friendliness thrown in (such as bad glue on interior panels). Electronic doo-dads added more trouble. The result: new ones are trouble-prone, with the more accessorized ones being much worse than basic models. But it is hard to find a basic model because dealers make their greatest profit mark-up from stupid stuff like "premium packages" and most Americans walk into a dealership and buy what is on the lot. In a lease-and-then-who-cares-after-four-years world, this is probably good strategy on the part of corporate management. But it is rough on the traditionalist who wants to keep his car a decade or more. To BMW's credit, cost-cutting never reached the dismal lows seen in, say, Chrysler products.

As for the automatic transmissions, much of the trouble was from the absurd recommendation that the fluid was a "lifetime" fluid. Extended maintenance intervals made the lease set happy but pushed the burden of replacing neglected components on to the second owners. But then again, isn't it absurd for someone to buy a BMW with an automatic? (The same is true for a Volvo).

I agree.

I've owned 2 older BMW's. You are correct, the cars before about 1998 are well built. I've seen many 3 and 5 series cars from the 80's and early 90's with 200 or 300K on them. Many with their original drivetrains. The four and six cylinder engines of that era are bulletproof...
--
93 850GLT 100k - my new daily driver - former little old lady's car :) 90 244DL 278k

I know 8 people with 850's and they are incredibly reliable. I drive mine 150 miles a day in constant traffic. I have a '95 850R and have owned it since 02/99. I currently have around 230,000 miles on the vehicle. Sure the A/C is a pain in the ass, but trust me coming from a BMW owner. That car has spent months at the dealer. My 850 has NEVER left me on the side of the road. My BMW has had to be towed because of cooling issues since '03 7 times. I've gone through 3 radiators, several exploded hoses, and a couple water pumps (the car has two BTW so really 4 pumps). I only drive the Bimmer evey other weekend if it's nice. I mean you can't completely compare the two, but the 850 still looks great, fast, handles well, and if you have snow tires it's tank. My brother has on many occasions drivin his NA 850 with probally only a quart - two quarts of oil and that thing took it (I don't advocate). You'll thank yourself months down the road if you buy the 850.

Regards
Sandro

I've owned 2 older 3 series for this exact reason...the newer ones are far too finniky and they really cheap out on the fit and finish of the mid 90's models.

My 86 325es and 88 325is have never let me down. Heck the repairs weren't any more than they were for my 81 245DL with the B21a!

After experiencing and enjoying the 86 325es, I had vowed to never look at another RWD volvo when I could get just as much reliability, durability and more fun out of the older BMW's. And consideirng I was a student in university the whole time made it that much better!

Then why are people quoting the life span of the engines and trannies to be about half that of the RWD series and why are there so many unhappy people raging about reliability all over the net? I agree that they're sexy, capable machines, it just seems like they're unreliable and as a college student I want to be careful about what I get my self into.

My Indy says the engine (Turbo) should go 250K with no problem. Non turbo, longer. I don't have any problem with that lifespan. I have 187K miles on mine, and it runs great with no oil consumption. Change the tranny fluid every 30K miles, and the tranny works fine. I don't read what "other" people on the net are saying. I read what the people here say, the people who work on the cars and maintain them themselves.

You sound convinced it is unreliable, so anything anyone here says seems like it is spitting in the wind. I concur with the guy who said his car never left him on the side of the road. That is my definition of "reliability". I don't believe I have ever seen an 850 sitting on the side of the road. Maybe they get solen before the towtruck arrives ;) Good luck with whatever other car you buy, because it sounds like you don't want one of these. More for us to choose from.

Don '95 854T 187K

Sadly, Volvo dropped manual transmissions pretty much across all its lines here in the US. Since I don't know how to drive an automatic, I had no choice but to buy the BMW.

The V70 is a "keeper" as my "winter beater".

-BTC

'98 V70T5 5-speed manual, 175,000 miles, heated velour cloth comfy chairs, IPD front stabilizer bar, factory rear bar and HD suspension, Bilstein HDs, Volvo strut tower brace & skidplate, Euro aspheric split-view mirror, XC grill, C70 jewel E-code headlights, Lidatek LE30, V-1, JB Weld, Duck tape, Zip-ties, Mobil-1 always, Michelin X-Ice

I don't understand: new Volvos are not available with manual transmission in USA? That was exactly one of the attractive features of the 1999 V70 that my wife and I bought in '99. We had to order it, but that was no problem. Whenever I drive an automatic, it reminds me how much I prefer real cars.

I had an 89 760T that I would love to have back in the condition it was in when I sold it. I've had (at the same time) 2 850 GLT low pressure turbos. I ain't impressed. For reliability, I would do a Toyota or ? I've also had a couple of BMW's (actually my wife had them.) I was sure she was having an affair with the mechanic. I have had three Mercedes. That's a car that I do admire.

No, it is not a lemon, it is a superb car. But all 850s are now 9+ years old, so condition is the overwhelming criteria. If it was meticulously maintained, it has plenty of life left. If it was neglected or slipped down the ownership path to secondary or tertiary owners (the "not put a dime into it" crowd), you will have infinite trouble.

The 850 is always going to loose in a head to head comparison with a similarly maintained red engine car. The interiors on the 850 always seem to explode out past 150k or so, they are way too plasticky and the driver's leather seat panels always wear out. Even if they both had the same laundry list of items that typically go bad it is going to cost you more to maintain the 850. Just off the top of my head the things that I routinely recommend on 850's:

Heater cores
a/c evaporators
engine mounts
torque stay bushings
control arms and/or bushings
breather boxes
radiators
timing belt tensioners and idler pullies
water pumps
fuel pumps
ignition contact plates
odo gears
dash light bulbs
struts and spring seats
engine oil pick up seals
assorted rotted vacuum lines
abs control units
axles and boots
ball joints
front hub/bearing assemblies

All that being said, seeing as how I own and run a Volvo repair shop, I wish the whole darn world drove them. There is no money working on good cars.

Mark