This car is the car that I have been looking for. It is truly love at first sight. A big sedan with room and safety for the wife and kids, and really fun to drive for the dad (I am looking at a 2000 model T6 with 54k miles).

I want to buy this car. It makes my heart race and my mouth water. However, EVERYTHING I read about this car makes me want to stay far from it. Here are a few questions?

Are all of these cars moneypits?

Does the ETM have a 100% failure rate?

Does the new warranty mean that a person can "preemptively" replace the ETM?

The two things that I see on the message boards over and over are the ETMs and the O2 sensors. Am I reading the message boards correctly? In other words, if it were not for these two components, would the reliability of this car be comparable to the reliability of most other cars?

Please help me. I don't think that I can live through another Subaru Outback. I guess I will have to give in and start looking at the Bimmers.

TK, you're a family man. Life is full of great things to do with the wife and kids. Do you really want a money pit and maintenance hog car? I know that in your shoes, I would not buy a S80. Also, I can tell you from personal experience that Volvo NA treats its customers whose cars are out of warranty in a shitty manner.

Yes. People who have never owned one.

and it still drives great. We use the 940 as a beater, for bad weather and as a airport and marina parking lot car. Alot of people complain, but I`ve been happy. Mine is a 2001 bought in jan,05 for $14,500 so that is $16,000 less than new and I can do a lot of maintneance for 16k.
Regards,
Lane

The nature of a board like this is to create a forum for people to complain about their problems. That said, the S80 indeed has its problems. But I believe it's a good car overall. I have owned 5 Volvos all turbos. My most recent is a 2000 S80 T-6 with 82K. I bought it used and insisted that the control units for both the throttle body and ABS were replaced before I purchased. Thank you Brickboard! I have had to fix a rattle in the sunroof myself. However my dealer of choice in Columbus, Ohio, Segna Motors, has always provided outstanding service. They recently repaired an oil leak and suspension rattle at no charge to me. I didn't even buy the car from these guys! I believe overall this is a good ride. If you like the car, have it checked out by a dealer and have the control units replaced. My Volvo seems to be faster, safer and roomier than anything in its class.

The later model S80's are better. I have an '04 2.5T with 36k and have had no problems. My overall experience with Volvo has been good. I have put over 2 million miles on Volvos since 1967. My suggeston is to find a good independent Volvo shop, stay away from the dealers, and follow the service schedule. In '04 I purchased a Volvo S80 and a Toyota Camry. Both have about the same miles on them now and both have had no problems. I am going to compare the service requirements of the the two. The Toyota has a four and the Volvo a turbo 5. The Toyota gets an average of 32-34 MPG and the Volvo 28-30 MPG. On long trips the Toyota gets about 36-38 MPG and the Volvo 32-34 MPG. The Volvo gives a better ride and had a solid feel to it. The Camry seems more nimble. I use synthetic oil, and K&N air filters in both. At one time Volvo's were the safest cars on the road, but other than that I really doubt they have ever been any better than other cars in their class. Some Volvo owners have put very high miles on their cars, but there are other car brand owners who have done the same. It will be interesting to see what happens to Volvo under the Ford banner.

You like challenges, don't you?

I'm getting too old for this. I'd buy a Lexus.

I belong to BMWCCA (the BMW club) and I woudn't buy a BMW if I were in your situation, either.

-BTC

'98 V70T5M, 166,000 miles, IPD stabilizer bar, factory HD suspension, Bilstein HDs, Volvo tower brace & skidplate, e-code headlights, V-1, Mobil-1

"The major difference between a thing that might go wrong and a thing that cannot possibly go wrong is that when a thing that cannot possibly go wrong goes wrong it usually turns out to be impossible to get at or repair." -- Douglas Adams (1952-2001)

Looking at this board and several others, you would think that Volvo no longer had customers. The fact that Volvo used a straight 6cyl in the early 70's and again in the 90's, would lead customers to believe that it is a cutting edge design and very reliable engine. The problem with the inline 6's was and still continues to be fuel milage and cooling. Volvo no longer produces a 6 cylinder.
The S80 is the top of the line, or should be. Now that the ETM is covered until 200K miles (the original will fail), your only question is dealer availibility. And it probably is required for software downloading, call a dealer and ask.
Are there BMW, Audi, Mercedes, Lexus dealers around your area? Other Volvo owners you can talk to locally? Just put your business card under their wiper with a request to talk.
Personally, I like the S80 from the outside.

Klaus
--
(1975 164, 1995 854T, 1998 V70R)

Volvo has had four, count 'em, four totally different 6 cylinder engines in recent history.
First one was a stretched red-block pushrod engine of 3 L.
Next was the diesel six.
Next, maybe around the same time, was the PRV V6 in 2.6, 2.7 and 2.8L versions.
Finally the white block six.
As far as I know it is still being supplied in the S80, at least in the US.

S'V'

First, thanks for your thoughtful reply.

I must have not read the message boards carefully enough. I thought that when the ETM failed, it had to be replaced. But, are you suggesting that the problem is software? And, moreover, people are spending in excess of $600 for a software upgrade when the ETM fails?

Perhaps, I should be looking at the S60 T5 models. They are still sporty, still safe, and more reliable. Would you agree with that assessment?

When the ETM fails, and it will, the cost used to be about $1200 at the dealer. The new part would not work without a software upgrade, dealer supplied, and part of their cost included in the $1200.
Normal software upgrades are dependent on what dealers charge per hour. Most are under one hour of labor.

Klaus

--
(1975 164, 1995 854T, 1998 V70R)

If the ETM does fail, Volvo may replace it for you:

http://www.brickboard.com/AWD/?id=1011836

-Daire

I live in Northwest Arkansas and the closest Volvo dealership is about 100 miles away in Tulsa, OK.

Are there any "authorized warranty service providers" who can provide warranty service that is not a Volvo dealer?

For example, could a Ford dealership provide warranty service on a Volvo?

I currently take my car to an "authorized NAPA service provider." They generally do work less expensively than dealers, but more expensively than the run of the mill shade-tree mechanic and provide a modest warranty on all of their work. Could they change an ETM and be reimbursed by Volvo?

Guess it all depends on what level of hassle you enjoy. If its minimal, do a Ford or Chevy. Can't go wrong in the America Outback.

Me, I live over 300 kms from the nearest Volvo dealer but have a indie in town that deals with them quite a bit. He does not necessarily have all the kit to do software loads, etc. on the new ones but can deal with my two (a '96 and '98) OK. I also do most of my own work for "normal" maintenance, plus I have that Volvo software that no one mentions, an OBD scanner, and 35 years of messing about with Euro cars to back me up.

Good luck,

NO, no other dealer or repair shop can DL the required SW into your car if and when needed, like replacing an ETM.
If you don't like the idea of driving 100 miles one way, and that could easily be more often than you'ld like, then I'd highly advise buying a brand of car where local service isn't an issue. In other words, if I were in a small town and the only dealer was a Ford dealer, I'd buy a Ford.

...a Toyota/Lexus or Honda/Acura. Still.

It's better to never need a dealer's service department than to have a service department nearby and need it all the time. FWIW, Honda/Acura still has paper shop manuals and I can do most of the routine servicing myself. It's pretty much idiot-proof.

-BTC

'98 V70 T5 5-speed, 166k mi, front IPD stabilizer bar, rear factory HD bar, Bilstein HD, Volvo strut tower brace and skidplate, e-codes, V-1, Mobil-1 since new

I agree whole heartedly about buying a car that can be serviced locally. If you really want a Volvo, then buy a '98 or earlier model so that nothing is so software dependent. With these, you can either do most of the work yourself, or there are those around who know them and can do the work for you. Personally, I like the '98 S70, which I own...they are cheap now and aren't high maitenance and don't have an ETM.
--
1998 S70 T5 Emarald Green Metallic, 2004 V70 2.5T Ruby Red, Previous Owner of Black '94 850 Turbo Wagon. My cars have been running so well lately they've got me worried.

" I agree whole heartedly about buying a car that can be serviced locally"

...and I'm not just referring to newer Volvos, I'd bet that most newer cars either now also require SW or are so technically advanced that most indy techs aren't likely to know much about them or be able to do all the required repairs. I'd be damned if I'd be driving for hours everytime a CEL comes on or has other electrical issues (frequent with newer cars).

"I'd bet that most newer cars either now also require SW or are so technically advanced that most indy techs aren't likely to know much..."

You are right on the money about this. You CAN always learn enough about your car and always have a back-up car if you're willing to do most things yourself. But with really new cars, this is a risky proposition...towing a new car 100 miles to the dealer can get old. :( :(
--
1998 S70 T5 Emarald Green Metallic, 2004 V70 2.5T Ruby Red, Previous Owner of Black '94 850 Turbo Wagon. My cars have been running so well lately they've got me worried.

i would sure hope a ford dealer would do that for you.
--
87 244, 235K (sold) and 87 245, 314K (RIP), 95 850 GLT 158K---Woodstock, CT