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Volvo RWD 900 Forum

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READ ONLY    PRINT   SAVE  940GLE High Idle--HELP, run out of ideas! 900 1991 posted by  sevenofnine on  Wed Jul 1 23:58 CST 2009 Author: [PROFILE] [EVERY POST] [THREADS] [BEST POSTS]     [IGNORE ALL POSTS] last visit: Fri Jul 17 01:49 CST 2009 [RELATED] Persistent high idle - 1600rpm. I have bought a new idle control valve, made no difference. Disconnected valve and plugged pipes, idle drops to 600 rpm. Tested TPS, even at ECU connector, no fault,(shows low ohms, touch accelerator and goes high). On starting engine, idle speed correct for about 1 minute and then abruptly goes to 1600rpm and stays there. Does this consistently as if there is a timer controlling it somewhere. Could the new idle valve be faulty? (not a Bosch but a substitute 0280140516). Have performed test at pin 2 of test button and I can hear the idle valve clicking as it should. I have run out of ideas! Mark this post as an answer to my question<- Use this feature to mark quality replies to your post. Select, copy to buffer, and paste anywhere: <a href="http://www.brickboard.com/RWD/volvo/1357755/940/960/980/V90/S90/940gle_high_idlehelp_run_ideas.html">940GLE High Idle--HELP, run out of ideas!</a>

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  READ ONLY    PRINT   SAVE  940GLE High Idle--HELP, run out of ideas! 900 1991 posted by  Dave Stevens on  Thu Jul 2 14:33 CST 2009 Author: [PROFILE] [EVERY POST] [THREADS] [BEST POSTS]     [IGNORE ALL POSTS] last visit: Fri Nov 20 01:01 CST 2009 [RELATED] Your symptoms are also consistent with a bad engine coolant temp (ECT) sensor. Check the 700/900 FAQ section on diagnosing ECT failures. -- Dave -940's, prev 740/240/140/120 You'd think I'd have learned by now Mark this post as an answer to my question<- Use this feature to mark quality replies to your post. Select, copy to buffer, and paste anywhere: <a href="http://www.brickboard.com/RWD/volvo/1357866/940/960/980/V90/S90/940gle_high_idlehelp_run_ideas.html">940GLE High Idle--HELP, run out of ideas!</a>

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  READ ONLY    PRINT   SAVE  940GLE High Idle--HELP, run out of ideas! 900 1991 posted by  Steve on  Thu Jul 2 06:17 CST 2009 Author: [PROFILE] [EVERY POST] [THREADS] [BEST POSTS]     [IGNORE ALL POSTS] last visit: Sat Nov 21 21:38 CST 2009 [RELATED] I had the same problem and it indeed was the TPS. Make sure your TPS is tested according to the procedure in the FAQ with both high and low end stops tested. -- See the 700/900 FAQ at the drop-down menu above right. Mark this post as an answer to my question<- Use this feature to mark quality replies to your post. Select, copy to buffer, and paste anywhere: <a href="http://www.brickboard.com/RWD/volvo/1357773/940/960/980/V90/S90/940gle_high_idlehelp_run_ideas.html">940GLE High Idle--HELP, run out of ideas!</a>

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    READ ONLY    PRINT   SAVE  940GLE High Idle--HELP, run out of ideas! 900 1991 posted by  sevenofnine on  Thu Jul 2 23:15 CST 2009 Author: [PROFILE] [EVERY POST] [THREADS] [BEST POSTS]     [IGNORE ALL POSTS] last visit: Fri Jul 17 01:49 CST 2009 [RELATED] Thanks for suggestions--- just went out and checked TPS and coolant temp sender as per FAQs and both were in spec. Beginning to think that new idle valve IS faulty! Still high idle. Mark this post as an answer to my question<- Use this feature to mark quality replies to your post. Select, copy to buffer, and paste anywhere: <a href="http://www.brickboard.com/RWD/volvo/1357921/940/960/980/V90/S90/940gle_high_idlehelp_run_ideas.html">940GLE High Idle--HELP, run out of ideas!</a>

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      READ ONLY    PRINT   SAVE  940GLE High Idle--HELP, run out of ideas! 900 1991 posted by  runwld2 on  Fri Jul 3 16:24 CST 2009 Author: [PROFILE] [EVERY POST] [THREADS] [BEST POSTS]     [IGNORE ALL POSTS] last visit: Thu Nov 19 09:49 CST 2009 [RELATED] The GLE is a 16v, correct? My 16v has a high idle, not exactly 1600, but high, and is definately running rich. So our problems may be different. If you have a scope you can check the signal to the idle motor. As I remember it's +12 on the center terminal and square waves on the 2 outer ones. Using a scope like this provides really fast diagnosis. O scopes are pretty cheap these days as portables with LCD screens. I don't have one but am thinking about it (still have the old CRT Tektronix). -- 84 242Ti IPD bars&springs, 89 745 16v M46 IPD bars, 89 744 16v M46 IPD bars, 90 745 AW70, 91 245SE AW70 IPD bars, 93 245 CLassic M47 Mark this post as an answer to my question<- Use this feature to mark quality replies to your post. Select, copy to buffer, and paste anywhere: <a href="http://www.brickboard.com/RWD/volvo/1358011/940/960/980/V90/S90/940gle_high_idlehelp_run_ideas.html">940GLE High Idle--HELP, run out of ideas!</a>

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        READ ONLY    PRINT   SAVE  940GLE High Idle--HELP, run out of ideas! 900 1991 posted by  sevenofnine on  Fri Jul 3 20:49 CST 2009 Author: [PROFILE] [EVERY POST] [THREADS] [BEST POSTS]     [IGNORE ALL POSTS] last visit: Fri Jul 17 01:49 CST 2009 [RELATED] Yes its a 16 valve. By chance I do have a CRT scope, I'll dig it out and put it on the idle valve as you suggest. I'll report back with my findings. Mark this post as an answer to my question<- Use this feature to mark quality replies to your post. Select, copy to buffer, and paste anywhere: <a href="http://www.brickboard.com/RWD/volvo/1358050/940/960/980/V90/S90/940gle_high_idlehelp_run_ideas.html">940GLE High Idle--HELP, run out of ideas!</a>

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          READ ONLY    PRINT   SAVE  940GLE High Idle--HELP, run out of ideas! 900 1991 posted by  Dave Stevens on  Sat Jul 4 01:41 CST 2009 Author: [PROFILE] [EVERY POST] [THREADS] [BEST POSTS]     [IGNORE ALL POSTS] last visit: Fri Nov 20 01:01 CST 2009 [RELATED] Perhaps time to get back to basics. If the TPS, IAC and ECT more or less check out electrically then I think your talking too much air. There are a few possibilities. I'll dump all my thoughts here in one go. If the engine is running rough then it's likely too much unmetered air, i.e. a vacuum leak. For vacuum leaks, check for disconnected/split hoses going to the throttle body -check both ends, check the hose going to the evaporative control (charcoal) canister (below and behind the left headlamp assembly), check for splits in the accordion section of the main air intake tube. Based on what you've said so far I don't think you've got a simple vacuum leak. So let's assume there's too much metered air, i.e. too much air getting past the throttle plate. That either means the IAC is allowing too much bypass air or the throttle plate itself is too open. To check out the case where the IAC is allowing too much bypass air, try the following. FYI With your LH 2.4 system the IAC is a two wire valve normally kept closed by a spring while the older type (found on 240's with LH 2.2) is a three wire valve and the piston floats free. So for your system, when the idle is too high and with the engine fully warmed, just unplug the IAC connector to fully close it. If the idle drops then the IAC is being held too far open by the ECU and the problem is likely elsewhere, especially a sensor (like the ECT). If the idle doesn't drop then either the IAC is sticking open or the ECU already has it fully closed and the problem is elsewhere (like the throttle plate). A quick check for a sticking IAC is to tap it rapidly with the end of a stick and see if the idle drops. As you've done, using the OBD test to cycle the IAC wide open is useful and if repeated many times often helps to refresh the full range of valve movement. In your case, I'm very suspicious that as your engine warms up, the IAC is quickly being put in the fully closed position by the ECU, but there is simply too much air still getting past the throttle plate, i.e. the plate isn't properly closing. Once properly set, there should be no need to touch any of the throttle body adjustments (from the TPS right up to the throttle cable), but if there is any chance they have been touched then a full readjustment is in order (don't feel too bad if it's you, I've been there myself trying to get my 16 valve to idle nice and smooth). Although unlikely in your case, if the throttle plate is simply sticking, try to manually close it and see if the idle drops. The throat could be dirty or the throttle shaft could be set too far into the TPS and binding. Now in your case, as you've already checked the common idle culprits, I'd want to make sure the throttle body is indeed properly adjusted before going further. I'll start by noting that the adjustment procedure in the FAQ for the throttle position switch is not as precise as it could be plus there are different procedures for Bosch and VDO switches. For a proper throttle body adjustment you should proceed as follows (I've posted this before, but can't find it): 1) Open the lower end cap of the throttle linkage rod, pop off the end cap and remove the throttle body. Thoroughly clean the throat, plate and vacuum orifices. You can remove the brass vacuum fittings to clear them. Blow out the small orifices through to the throat (a needle and small drill bit can be carefully used to ream the orifices if needed). While you're at it, make sure the small hose from the throttle body to the flame trap is clear -not uncommon to be plugged for cars driven very short distances. 2) On the throttle body, back off the idle stop screw. Loosen the TPS switch. If you have any doubts about the TPS switch then test with an ohmmeter connected between the centre and outer pin (one outer pin is for idle closed the other pin is for WOT full open -not used by LH 2.4). 3) Make sure the throttle plate is centered and can close properly without binding -look through the throttle body at a light source and ensure an even ring of space around the edge when closed. 4) Hold the plate closed. Advance the idle stop screw until it just touches the stop and the plate is about to start opening. Advance 1/4 turn more then secure with the lock nut. 5) Adjust the TPS switch. As you know, it should click just as you move the throttle away from its stop (and click again on the return). For proper adjustment start with the switch rotated clockwise away from the stop position. For a Bosch switch, hold the throttle plate closed, turn the switch counter-clockwise until it clicks then continue to end of travel and lock in place. For a VDO switch, insert a .010" feeler gauge at the idle stop screw (if you don't have a suitable feeler gauge substitute two strips of medium heavy bond 24 lb. computer paper), turn the switch slowly counter-clockwise until the click is heard then lock in place. 6) Re-mount the throttle body. Use a new gasket unless the old one is in perfect shape. Connect and adjust the linkage rod as follows. These aren't critical adjustments, but they are the official specs. For a B230FT (or B230F on a 740), insert a .10" feeler gauge at the throttle *spindle* stop tab (not the idle stop screw). Adjust the linkage rod so that the throttle begins to open and the TPS click is heard then adjust it back to the point where the closing click is just heard and secure the rod adjusting nuts. For a B230F on a 240 use a .08" feeler. For a B234F use a .13" feeler (.06" for the early '89 production B234F's w/auto trans). 7) Re-adjust the accelerator (gas pedal) cable as needed for a little slack making sure the cable is properly seated in the spindle. 8) For an automatic, you should then re-adjust the downshift cable (next to the throttle cable) -see the FAQ. 9) Re-install all vacuum lines. Replace any that are split or loose on their fittings. Make sure you haven't pulled the other end of the lines off their fittings, especially the ones on the charcoal canister (big black plastic canister up front, typically behind and below the left front headlamp assembly). Don't forget to replace the TPS connector -easily forgotten. 10) For an LH 2.2 system, check/reset the base idle using the thumbscrew while grounding the idle control valve signal from the open test connector on the fender -see the FAQ. Now the throttle body and TPS should be out of the equation. I really hope somewhere in the above you'll find a fresh lead to your problem. -- Dave -940's, prev 740/240/140/120 You'd think I'd have learned by now Mark this post as an answer to my question<- Use this feature to mark quality replies to your post. Select, copy to buffer, and paste anywhere: <a href="http://www.brickboard.com/RWD/volvo/1358080/940/960/980/V90/S90/940gle_high_idlehelp_run_ideas_throttle_body_adjustment_tb_tps_switch.html">940GLE High Idle--HELP, run out of ideas!</a>

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          READ ONLY    PRINT   SAVE  940GLE High Idle--HELP, run out of ideas! 900 1991 posted by  sevenofnine on  Sat Jul 4 00:28 CST 2009 Author: [PROFILE] [EVERY POST] [THREADS] [BEST POSTS]     [IGNORE ALL POSTS] last visit: Fri Jul 17 01:49 CST 2009 [RELATED] OK, I connected the CRO and started the engine. Idle speed ok. Square wave with about 60/40 mark/space ratio. 10 seconds later the mark/space ratio changes to 95/5 and the idle speed is up at 1600 rpm. Looks like something is telling the ECU to open the idle valve more. Checked the coolant sensor (again!) and is in spec. TPS ok. Swapped with two other ECUs and the fault persists. Darned if I know! Mark this post as an answer to my question<- Use this feature to mark quality replies to your post. Select, copy to buffer, and paste anywhere: <a href="http://www.brickboard.com/RWD/volvo/1358078/940/960/980/V90/S90/940gle_high_idlehelp_run_ideas.html">940GLE High Idle--HELP, run out of ideas!</a>

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            READ ONLY    PRINT   SAVE  940GLE High Idle--HELP, run out of ideas! 900 1991 posted by  Dave Stevens on  Sat Jul 4 02:29 CST 2009 Author: [PROFILE] [EVERY POST] [THREADS] [BEST POSTS]     [IGNORE ALL POSTS] last visit: Fri Nov 20 01:01 CST 2009 [RELATED] Peter, Didn't catch your latest post before entering my massive tome. I agree, that 95/5 mark/space ratio is very telling, but if the ECT really checks out there is only one other thing I can think of that changes the world soon after startup and that's the O2 sensor (it's ignored until the engine starts to warm). The O2 sensor really only affects mix and thus shouldn't change the idle other than making for a rough or unsteady idle. I like diagnosing with meters as much as the next guy, but I'll still recommend you go back and start with a properly adjusted throttle body. Good luck. -- Dave -940's, prev 740/240/140/120 You'd think I'd have learned by now Mark this post as an answer to my question<- Use this feature to mark quality replies to your post. Select, copy to buffer, and paste anywhere: <a href="http://www.brickboard.com/RWD/volvo/1358081/940/960/980/V90/S90/940gle_high_idlehelp_run_ideas.html">940GLE High Idle--HELP, run out of ideas!</a>

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              READ ONLY    PRINT   SAVE  940GLE High Idle--HELP, run out of ideas! 900 1991 posted by  sevenofnine on  Sat Jul 4 03:13 CST 2009 Author: [PROFILE] [EVERY POST] [THREADS] [BEST POSTS]     [IGNORE ALL POSTS] last visit: Fri Jul 17 01:49 CST 2009 [RELATED] Dave, thanks for your massive input into my problem. I will check the throttle plate thoroughly tomorrow (its evening here in Australia at the moment) and I do have a new o2 sensor in the cupboard and I'll install that now that you have suggested it. But I'll do one thing at a time so as I can see which fixes the fault. Regards, Peter Mark this post as an answer to my question<- Use this feature to mark quality replies to your post. Select, copy to buffer, and paste anywhere: <a href="http://www.brickboard.com/RWD/volvo/1358083/940/960/980/V90/S90/940gle_high_idlehelp_run_ideas.html">940GLE High Idle--HELP, run out of ideas!</a>

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                READ ONLY    PRINT   SAVE  940GLE High Idle--HELP, run out of ideas! 900 1991 posted by  sdewolfe on  Sat Jul 4 05:43 CST 2009 Author: [PROFILE] [EVERY POST] [THREADS] [BEST POSTS]     [IGNORE ALL POSTS] last visit: Sat Nov 21 06:01 CST 2009 [RELATED] Howdy, The O2 sensor would set a code and send the ECU to a default map. I think the ECU would not adjust idle speed for an O2 sensor out-of-range; I could be wrong! But, you did not mention a check engine light. If the ECU thinks the engine is loaded it will set the IAC valve to compensate. Check the gear select signal to the ECU and the AC ON switch. Neither of those would set a code. If the ECU thinks the AC is on, it would also turn on the cooling fan. Does that happen even if the car is cold? Do you have a wiring diagram for your car? -- Mr. Shannon DeWolfe -- I've taken to using mister because my name misleads folks on the WWW. I am a 53 year old fat man. ;-) Mark this post as an answer to my question<- Use this feature to mark quality replies to your post. Select, copy to buffer, and paste anywhere: <a href="http://www.brickboard.com/RWD/volvo/1358098/940/960/980/V90/S90/940gle_high_idlehelp_run_ideas.html">940GLE High Idle--HELP, run out of ideas!</a>

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                  READ ONLY    PRINT   SAVE  940GLE High Idle--HELP, run out of ideas! 900 1991 posted by  sevenofnine on  Sat Jul 4 22:53 CST 2009 Author: [PROFILE] [EVERY POST] [THREADS] [BEST POSTS]     [IGNORE ALL POSTS] last visit: Fri Jul 17 01:49 CST 2009 [RELATED] Checked O2 sensor voltage at ECU pin 24 - varying between .3 and .7 volt at idle, no change here when engine jumps to high idle. AC on/off voltage is correct on ECU pin 14. Have tried three other ECUs - high idle fault persists. Throttle body - I cannot fault. Disconnected and plugged manifold, brake booster hose and aux vacuum hose - fault persists. I have observed that when the idle valve is plugged, idle drops to 600 rpm and then slowly rises to 900 rpm. is this normal? Is it the ECU compensating or is this telling me something? Thanks for all your suggestions so far. Mark this post as an answer to my question<- Use this feature to mark quality replies to your post. Select, copy to buffer, and paste anywhere: <a href="http://www.brickboard.com/RWD/volvo/1358208/940/960/980/V90/S90/940gle_high_idlehelp_run_ideas.html">940GLE High Idle--HELP, run out of ideas!</a>

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                    READ ONLY    PRINT   SAVE  940GLE High Idle--HELP, run out of ideas! 900 1991 posted by  sevenofnine on  Sun Jul 5 23:24 CST 2009 Author: [PROFILE] [EVERY POST] [THREADS] [BEST POSTS]     [IGNORE ALL POSTS] last visit: Fri Jul 17 01:49 CST 2009 [RELATED] I've given up on this very frustrating problem for the moment. I'll wait for my son to visit soon with his 740 so as I can swap parts and see if I can find the fault that way. I will keep the forum posted as I'm sure when I find the fault, the solution could be useful to others. Mark this post as an answer to my question<- Use this feature to mark quality replies to your post. Select, copy to buffer, and paste anywhere: <a href="http://www.brickboard.com/RWD/volvo/1358346/940/960/980/V90/S90/940gle_high_idlehelp_run_ideas.html">940GLE High Idle--HELP, run out of ideas!</a>

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                      READ ONLY    PRINT   SAVE  940GLE High Idle--HELP, run out of ideas! 900 1991 posted by  sevenofnine on  Fri Jul 17 01:55 CST 2009 Author: [PROFILE] [EVERY POST] [THREADS] [BEST POSTS]     [IGNORE ALL POSTS] last visit: Fri Jul 17 01:49 CST 2009 [RELATED] Well my son came to visit with his tools and his 740 and we fixed it!! I'd like to thanks Dave Stevens for his help because it turned out to be the throttle body after all. What I couldn't see until we pulled the throttle body off with my sons no.30 torx screw, was that the TPS was missing a lower screw and was maladjusted to the extent it was holding the throttle open slightly. It still functioned ok as a switch but Dave was right, this throttle has to be adjusted correctly. Thanks everyone for your help. Mark this post as an answer to my question<- Use this feature to mark quality replies to your post. Select, copy to buffer, and paste anywhere: <a href="http://www.brickboard.com/RWD/volvo/1360374/940/960/980/V90/S90/940gle_high_idlehelp_run_ideas.html">940GLE High Idle--HELP, run out of ideas!</a>

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                        READ ONLY    PRINT   SAVE  Congrats! Always good to have someone post back, especially to thank me ;) --NMI 900 1991 posted by  Dave Stevens on  Fri Jul 17 18:22 CST 2009 Author: [PROFILE] [EVERY POST] [THREADS] [BEST POSTS]     [IGNORE ALL POSTS] last visit: Fri Nov 20 01:01 CST 2009 [RELATED] Mark this post as an answer to my question<- Use this feature to mark quality replies to your post. Select, copy to buffer, and paste anywhere: <a href="http://www.brickboard.com/RWD/volvo/1360502/940/960/980/V90/S90/congrats_always_good_someone_post_back_especially_thank_nmi.html">Congrats! Always good to have someone post back, especially to thank me ;) --NMI</a>

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