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Re: Technical Oil Question[740-760/1986] posted by Mark on
Wednesday, 15 April 1998, at 12:13 p.m.
I have been following a posting on a boat.rec board re toilet paper filters. Just saw one at a boating supply shop (made in NZ) and was curious. These filters are used for both fuel filters and oil filters. The fuel filter on my diesel boat is 2 microns and the tp filters supposedly filter to about .5 microns. Not too much of an improvement. For engine oil, however, most claim that full flow filters are primarily designed to filter out metal particles, not carbon. Claim is that full flows get out the chunks, but a bypass (filtering 2-5% of the oil) is necessary to get carbon out. You want the metal chunks out immediately, but the carbon can be filtered out in a more leasurely manner. Depe3nding on the rate of carbon entering the oil, 2-5% filtration may keep up with carbon removal.
Black color isn't a good indicator. Some detergent additives will turn black but do not indicate dirty oil.
The thing that facinates me about the toilet paper filters is the claim that the full flow filter can be retained for several years. The tp is changed every 5K (25 cents for the roll and 1 quart of oil). The addition of one quart of oil is sufficient to replace the additives. That's the claim. Save money and increase oil quality. Haven't put one on my boat ($8K diesel) or my car ($2K B20). Saving $10 each change is great, but the down side is huge.
Would like to know if there's a fitting to change the side-mount Mann filter to a 90 degree "screw-up" mount. My B20 has enough oil on it without slopping it down the side during oil changes. (Rumor is OPEC wants to buy my car because of its ability to pump out oil) I know remote units are generally "screw-up" types, but is there just a cast conversion part that screws directly to the block and changes the filter mount by 90 degrees? If not, why not?
Mark
73 1800ES
Re: Technical Oil Question[740-760/1986] posted by Steve Seekins on
Friday, 17 April 1998, at 8:00 a.m.
The remote oil filter kits are no longer in the IPD catalog - I don't know if they still have them. I have seen them before, but as I remember, the source was JC Whitney or some such, and the aluminum castings for the engine block adapter and the remote filter bracket were poor and had many voids. Even some of the ipd units suffered from this.
One alternative is to use the AMSOIL remote/bypass filter manifold. This incorporates both the standard full flow filter AND a bypass filter. The AMSOIL manifold is machined from billet aluminum and is very nice. AMSOIL also offfers a single filter manifold that allows remote mounting of the standard filter - retails for $112 - though if there is room, it doesn't make any sense not to use the dual manifold.
The previous post noted one form of bypass filter system where both filters are full flow filters, and oil goes to the first one until it becomes clogged, then the oil is automatically sent to the second full flow filter. These systems are typically used on heavy industrial equipment and are usually designed so that the clogged filter can be isolated and changed without shutting down the equipment.
The AMSOIL bypass filter system is a completely different concept. Here, there is a full flow filter (your standard Volvo or Mann filter) that filters all the oil normally as if it were screwed onto the block, except that it it mounted in a concenient location away from the block and out from under the exhaust manifold. The second filter is a special large filter that filters down to less than a micron particle size. This is sufficient to filter out even the small carbon particles that turn the oil black in a short time. However, not all of the oil passes through this filter - only a small percentage goes through it with the remainder 'bypassing' the filter. However, over time, all of the oil does pass through and is filtered. The reason that 100% does not flow through all the time is that the filter is so fine that to accommodate the full oil flow it would have to be huge - so large that it would not easily fit in an engine compartment. In 120, 1800, and 140 compartments, there is plenty of room for the manifold on the firewall - usually on the right side, or perhaps on an inner fender. On the 240s there is also room on the firewall, even on the turbos, though it gets tight if you have the diagonal braces installed - but it can be done.
However, on the 700 turbos, room is a little tight, and I have not found a location I like for this system. However, one benefit - the remote and easily accessable filter is not so much a problem on the 700 turbos since they use an extension mount to place the filter further back and parallel to the block so that it is easier to reach.
The AMSOIL rig retails for $199 and comes 500psi rubber hydraulic hoses. It cost me an additional $80 at a speed shop for the stainless flex lines and fittings I preferred to hook it up on my B21FT/242T. You just change the full flow filter at normal intervals (I slip a ziplock baggie around it and unscrew it, prefill the new filter and screw it on). The special bypass filter gets replaced about every 6 months to 1 year depending on how much driving I do and costs $25. Oil stays clean and clear like new and tests fine - even after 100,000 miles (on AMSOIL). I expect that Mobil 1 should do nearly as well, but would not try it with other brands without regular oil analysis.
There were a couple of comments about oil analyses. A report that says everything is 'OK' is not sufficient. What you need is a complete printout of the quantitative results of the spectral analysis with comments, and a comparison to your engine baseline for trend analysis along with qualitative analysis of the oil properties. For this, you will generally need to pay for the test, and if you use the same service each tiime, they should keep a record of your engine for the trend analysis.
Steve Seekins