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Changing ATF on 1993 850[ALL/1998] posted by mark e. barron on
Tuesday, 20 May 1997, at 12:44 p.m.
A very nice fellow on the BrickBoard sent me a fax of Volvo's docs for changing ATF. He asked only that I update him on any problems I found. This was my email response to him. I thought you all might be interested. ----- Garth! I changed the ATF. I was unable to do the job I wanted because of two problems. First I did not have a large TORX bit to get the pan off. The pan is attached with with TORX screws and is at an angle sloping up. Access to some of the screws is going to be difficult. After talking to as many people as I could, I am left with the belief that there is a screen behind the pan that should be cleaned out. The drain plug is positioned so that it screws inhorizontally , seem to remember it is on the outboard side. . There is a crush washer that people say to replace, I could not get one at VOLVO dealer so I used the old one. Buy a long necked funnel, say 12 inches to add the ATF through the dipstick tube. I used clear gallon milk containers to track the amounts drained. Because I could not remove the pan and clean the filter, I put through 2 gallons of Dexton/Mercon and then 2 gallons of Mobil 1 synthetic $4/gal and $20/gal respectively. I figure I am left with somewhere less than 25% D/M after the mixing(going through the gears). I used Dexcron III because I did not find Dextron IIe. My understanding is that only Chrysler transmission have trouble with D III and must have D IIe. I would say that the directions (from Volvo docs) you sent me and the UK Haynes manual are fine with the single exception that there is no mention of how to deal with the clips that hold the tranny hoses into the radiator. The hose have , I suspect , O-rings that do the sealing of the fitting( the might be quite similar to air-hose fittings on power tools) the clips do not act at hose clamps but rather perform the function of insuring that the fittings do not separate from the fitting hole. I would say, it is most difficult to manage with one pair of hand to stretch out the clips enough to remove the hose and pull on the hose at the same time. A mechanic on the BrickBoard warned me of the clips and says he hate to deal with them and basically uses my method of flushing. If you do remove the hoses and do the job right, get a replacement clip or two and practice on the upper hose first, since it is easier to access. There is probably a tool for these clips. It would be a "reverse" plier (how is that for a new term) when you squeeze the handles the ends would separate. The perfect tool would have little indentation on the outside to hold the edges of the clip as you squeeze. A circlip tool might work. I would say the edges of the clips are about 1/4" apart initially and have to separated to about 3/4 " to get the hose fitting out. The clips are quite springy. I never saw the nipple on the fitting of the AT hose but would guess that a 3/8" OD clear plastic hose and a hose clamp would work for the monitoring of the bubbles outlined in the changing ATF documentation. THe drain plug is magnetized -- be sure to clean off the metal filings from it. I could have drained the old ATF and put it through a filter and then put it back in the tranny repeatly to get out the particulates and than added the synthetic. Can you tell me if VOLVO makes their AT or if they use american made ones?
Note: when you drain the pan you get perhaps 3 quarts, the rest stays in the torque converter and elsewhere in the tranny.
Good Luck!
Mark
Re: Changing ATF on 1993 850[ALL/1998] posted by Leo Montreuil on
Tuesday, 20 May 1997, at 3:08 p.m.
I do not know for the 850, but for the Honda AT, the screen is there to catch big piece of metal. In the Honda, the screen do not need to be cleaned where the ATF is changed. The screen needs to be cleaned only on major AT overhaul.
Also you asked about where is the AT is made. On my 97 855 GLT, there is a label (metal plate) on the top that indicate it is made in Japan. But I do not know who make it for Volvo.
Re: Changing ATF on 1993 850[ALL/1998] posted by Stoney on
Tuesday, 20 May 1997, at 3:37 p.m.
Mark, Ski sama desh da! (Good Job!)
RE:TORX you can get a nice set that will fit your socket wrench set at Sears,and the like. I have found that buying the high quality sets is worth it after snapping off a few of them.
Word of caution: I have found that the bolt hole threading on the oil and transmission pans on the 700/800/900 to be slightly more prone to Xthreading. Don't know wht other than TORX combined w/ operator error.
I have seen the type of reverse spreader pliers you spoke of, they are used in HVAC and Hydraulic biz. Check a good parts catalogue or try Skyway Tools. If they don't got, they get it- fast!
RE: Trans fluid flush. Did you consider setting up a fill situation similar to IV Bag/Bottle? Used to use this when working on Citroen DS19 suspension hydraulics.
ATF on 1993 850 Thanks Leo and Stoney[ALL/1998] posted by mark e. barron on
Wednesday, 21 May 1997, at 10:09 a.m.
I appreciate the input. I looked at www.skywaytools.com . Looks great. Glad to hear the screen is basically for large pieces. I hope I do not offend anyone by attaching the following , somehow site-appropriate grafitti that came across the internet a couple of days ago.
A Woman's Rule of Thumb: If it has tires or testicles, you're going to have trouble with it. -Women's restroom, Dick's Last Resort. Dallas, Texas.
Re: Changing ATF on 1993 850[ALL/1998] posted by Paul Elliott on
Thursday, 22 May 1997, at 8:16 a.m.
Mark, most of the Volvo documentation I've seen for my '95 850 Turbo indicates that the ATF is not, necessarily, a renewable item. Only if it is burned, or used under exceptional conditions like lots of towing, or taxi useage, need it be considered. So, I'm wondering, was your fluid in rotton shape, or do you change the fluid out of force of habit,,or some other reason? Just curious.
Re: Changing ATF on 1993 850[ALL/1998] posted by mark e. barron on
Thursday, 22 May 1997, at 2:01 p.m.
Paul , Hi, thanks for writing. I did talk to Volvo and I was aware that in their official policy no change was needed. I changed ATF for many reasons, not in any particular order. -All moving parts wear and need the help of lubricants -new lubricants/fluids are better that old - I am going to have a lot of pie on my face if this four year old car I just bought has tranny problems - I think the expensive part of the Volvo that is most likely to crap out is the AT - I deeply distrust people who say we have taken care of everything --" you don't need to service it for another 50-100k" - it did not cost much and gave me more peace of mind - Theddy (here on the BrickBoard) mentioned AT failures around 130k, i think it was, on his fleet of 850 taxis. - nice machines make me happy - I like to do what I can for them in return. - I change engine oil at, 3k if I can get to it. The fluid was quite brown,(red brown) and had plenty of metal filings in it, but did not smell burned to my nose or that of my wife If you looked at the ATF on the dipstick there was a marked brownish visible in the red against the yellow of the dipstick. At 87k , I was very glad that I had finally done it. I will never know if it was necessary, but I firmly believe it was. Mark
Re: Changing ATF on 1993 850[ALL/1998] posted by Theddy Cassaras on
Friday, 23 May 1997, at 1:12 p.m.
You're absolutely right, Mark! Better safe than sorry. You've just got yourself a very cheap insurance. Saying that the AT don't need any service is like telling you that they've invented the "perpetum mobile" (machine that works forever).
Theddy
Re: Changing ATF on 1993 850[ALL/1998] posted by Paul Elliott on
Friday, 30 May 1997, at 10:00 a.m.
Nevertheless, for some reason, while Volvo does recommend changing the brake fluid every 2 years, they say that coolant, if the owner maintains only Volvo type "c" fluid, will not normally need replacement...Likewise, the ATF is NOT normally a renewable item, unless subjected to towing, taxi-ing, or other hi stress driving. They specifically exempt these 2 fluids (only) from renewing type service.
Re: Changing ATF on 1993 850[ALL/1998] posted by Theddy Cassaras on
Friday, 30 May 1997, at 10:04 p.m.
As long as the ATF stays clear and red, you normally should not need to change it. There is also an age factor, I wouldn't keep the same oil for ten years, would you? And whatever Volvo says, the fact remains that we had several breakdowns on this transmission due to ATF not been changed. This makes me doubtful, so I would personally change the ATF somewhere between 50 - 100.000 miles, just to be sure. As to the break fluid, it should be changed every second year anyway. This is a safety factor.
Theddy